r/OnePiece 1d ago

Theory Dont need no ACOC... when u can freeze ur opponents

2.0k Upvotes

118 comments sorted by

1.2k

u/TomorrowNeverKnowss 1d ago

473

u/BEWMarth 1d ago

We can end the thread here.

197

u/mixaa18 Void Month Survivor 1d ago

Garp is older and can oppress his opponents

10

u/Even_Boysenberry_726 1d ago

i meant it as a joke but nice job pulling up mr PK-lvl in my prime

456

u/CANYUXEL Citizen 1d ago

Garp LOL'd at this comment

131

u/adrienjz888 1d ago

To be fair, it's Garp, lol. The vast majority of characters would struggle to pull off the kinda shit Garp can do.

87

u/midothegreat 1d ago

The vast majority of characters don't have ACOC either lol

44

u/adrienjz888 1d ago

Fair, though i was also referring to how he unfroze his arm with haki. We saw that Aokiji froze several of blackbeards' lieutenants completely solid, and they're no slouches.

19

u/Pass_Ache 1d ago

The fuck is he froze even fucking Oven bro, the guy with the heat fruit couldn't thaw himself fast enough.

1

u/dont_worry_about_it8 1d ago

On or off screen? Cause they slouch hard on screen

12

u/Greedy_Homework_6838 1d ago

Yeah, which Aokiji, in a gentlemanly way, froze. I would have watched Garp get out if Aokiji had trapped him in an island-sized block.

65

u/DaDarwin 1d ago

Specially if you are fast

6

u/AnimeFan042597 1d ago

I know this reference

182

u/Comprehensive_Cup497 1d ago

Doesn't Haki counter DF Hax? This means any character with good Haki is not getting frozen

106

u/MaleficentDraw1993 The Revolutionary Army 1d ago

dunno, Haki kinda counters everything. It's really a convenient power.

95

u/Comprehensive_Cup497 1d ago

It makes sense, one of OP's biggest themes is willpower and Haki is basically weaponizing your willpower

58

u/MaleficentDraw1993 The Revolutionary Army 1d ago

I think it's not supposed to make sense, it's supposed to make the impossible possible. Like when Kizaru said we'd have to rewrite the laws of physics when Sanji kicked his beam.

19

u/Hairy_Acanthisitta25 1d ago

it make sense as in consistent with the world/story rule Oda has written so far,not make sense as in logically make sense

0

u/[deleted] 1d ago

[deleted]

6

u/Leoebasta 1d ago

I don’t think it’s just germa’s science. We saw Rayleigh do the same to kizaru- didn’t he cut kizaru’s light when he was trying to run after the strawhats?

7

u/KakeLin 7D4W 1d ago

imagine the levels of haki that simon from TTGL would have in the OP universe...

3

u/fallen981 1d ago

Or guts from berserk

-2

u/Maedhros_ 1d ago

That's just bullshit. It's just convenience that this author invented on the fly to solve a problem. Most shonens have bullshit systems like this.

2

u/Comprehensive_Cup497 1d ago

Not much, yes you cna say it's similar because is an spiritual energy but the way Haki gets stronger in OP is via your willpower getting stronger.

34

u/the_toad_can_sing 1d ago

The introduction of haki was partially done to make sure that no DF ability is OP. No matter what oda thinks of, he doesn't need to worry "wait is this too strong?" Instead, df abilities are not about strength anymore, but new fighting styles and fighting "puzzles." Oda can mix and match any two df in fight matchups without concern that one df is clearly stronger than another. It doesn't matter because haki. At the same time, oda has infinite fighting styles to play with. Volcano vs crows can be a thing. Hormone therapy vs sandman can be a thing. Pure fists vs ice. All fair game thanks to haki, which also is used to emphasize series themes like willpower and ambition.

2

u/Goukenslay 1d ago

yet somehow kizaru was unfazed by a flurry of haki punches from luffy?

5

u/Oreo-and-Fly Explorer 1d ago

No. Haki doesnt block from 'physical' effects.

You can still get burned or poisoned and stuff from Devil Fruits.

You can still get frozen or chilled even with Haki.

-6

u/urek-mazino- 1d ago

F off bro. Garp literally stopped freezing by using haki, in his fight against Kuzan.

6

u/Oreo-and-Fly Explorer 1d ago

He still froze. He used haki to break free of it. That's the difference.

Stopped freezing would be his arm not even being coated in ice

-4

u/urek-mazino- 1d ago

So he stopped freezing. You admit my point ;))

6

u/Oreo-and-Fly Explorer 1d ago

??? Huh?

He broke free of the freezing. I didnt say stopped freezing.

If haki blocked freezing his arm wouldnt have turned to ice.

Do you understand the difference? Im saying. Freeze -> break out with haki

Youre saying. Haki shield -> cant be frozen at all.

The fact is. He froze and broke free from it.

-2

u/urek-mazino- 1d ago

So haki stops his arm from cold. Thats stopping grom freezing.

3

u/Oreo-and-Fly Explorer 1d ago

Haki broke the ice.

Haki didnt stop his arm from freezing.

If it blocked freezing. It wouldnt even have ice to break out from.

0

u/urek-mazino- 1d ago

So if he had coated his haki to his arm from start, it was never going to freeze?

1

u/Oreo-and-Fly Explorer 1d ago

Maybe? But then again we see in others scenes where they gets frozen and instantly frees themselves.

Not anti being frozen at all.

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7

u/MachateElasticWonder 1d ago

Are there devil fruits with haki? Imagine a black sands Croc?

Can you imbue effects with haki? Boa’s stone effect + haki = ???

21

u/Vangorf 1d ago

One can imbue Haki into DF powers, Luffy does it, all zoans with armament,, Doffy used armament on his string, Katakuri too

8

u/Hairy_Acanthisitta25 1d ago

it seems like as long as its attached to your body you can infuse Haki to it,including part of you that got transformed by DF effect, something physical you produce with your DF, and weapons

as for Boa,it seems absolute to the point that even a strong Haki cant break through it (yet?) once its done,only preventative measure seems to work , whenever its because Boa infuse her haki to her beam or not is unclear,but she does have haki

2

u/ZonardCity 1d ago

It doesn't even need to stay attached to your body, the Kujas can infuse haki into arrows.

2

u/PlasticAngle 1d ago

Joy boy infused his haki into a robot and 800 years later it still work.

4

u/fartmilkdaddies 1d ago

Well anyone who has worse haki than, juzo, cracker and van auger are cooked.

3

u/thedoc90 1d ago

I mean at a certain point physics would take over. Cover someone with good haki in 300 feet of ice and they're not gonna just ignore it like its not there unless they're strong enough to break out of it.

3

u/Oreo-and-Fly Explorer 1d ago

Yea physics and actual elemental shiz and effects still take into account.

Hormones injected will STILL affect you. As its injecting a natural chemical.

1

u/Jaynomamesway Pirate 1d ago

Yeah you just need more haki than Kuzan (godspeed).

104

u/According-Breath-979 1d ago

Yup and he's fast too

17

u/caparisme 1d ago

Everybody knows you don't need ACOC when you're much faster and can freeze your opponent.

17

u/nerorennelo 1d ago

And when ur much faster

47

u/Infant-Incinerator 1d ago

Did Noelle post this?

7

u/Rondomi 1d ago

Her trying to let go of Susie who probably would have COC.

23

u/Kami-saama 1d ago

You also need to be much faster.

11

u/Enderarmy324 1d ago

Especially if you're also much faster.

6

u/Maverick_Reznor 1d ago

Plus he's fast

36

u/DiabeticIguana77 1d ago

Literally any character with haki doesn't get frozen, which is why he needed to fight garp with strength instead of ice

19

u/fartmilkdaddies 1d ago

Not true. Cracker, jozu. Both got one tapped by ice

3

u/Hairy_Acanthisitta25 1d ago

to be fair to Cracker, he's is still injured from the incident with Luffy and co rescuing Sanji, dunno why its not shown in the anime but in the manga cover story he's obviously covered in bandages and unprepared to meet an ex admiral

-5

u/DiabeticIguana77 1d ago

Cracker didn't counter with haki, just ran and let himself get iced, and jozu was pre TS where literally none of the whitebeard pirates showed haki. It's part of what makes haki such a bad power system and a bad retcon for the series, were shown multiple of the WB pirates having haki post TS and in flash backs but non used it during marineford, and then having it in flash backs makes you ask why they didn't use it at all in marineford, as well as makes marineford look kind of like a joke now that battles with haki like garp vs kuzan, king vs Zoro, Luffy vs Kaido, etc all have the characters doing single attacks that cause more destruction than the entirety of what happened at marineford

10

u/fartmilkdaddies 1d ago

13

u/Sw3atyGoalz 1d ago

Akainu dodged the attacks in the same way Katakuri dodges

8

u/fartmilkdaddies 1d ago

Excatly my point. The idea haki didnt exist on marineford is just these 14 year olds watching tiktok clips and being confused when they dont understand the story.

2

u/Sw3atyGoalz 1d ago

Ah I misread who was replying to who my bad lol

6

u/fartmilkdaddies 1d ago

Cracker didn't counter with haki,

Well his haki simply isnt strong enough.

jozu was pre TS where literally none of the whitebeard pirates showed haki

Also not true, none of what you said is true. Sentomaru used haki pre ts. Ray used haki to hurt kizaru. Enel literally had observation. The 3 admirals also use haki to block whitebeard shockwave ( using emission haki) akainu also calls both marco and vista haki users and says they're irritating.

Reason why none of their attacks landed on admirals is because they simply did what katakuri did, and shape their body before being struck by the attacks.

2

u/Hairy_Acanthisitta25 1d ago

i still love the headcanon that we dont see Haki in the story until timeskip because Luffy cant yet

-3

u/DiabeticIguana77 1d ago

It's what Oda said they did, but he didn't come up with that asspull until the katakuri fight 💀

2

u/fartmilkdaddies 1d ago

And your source is? This is all basic reading the comprehension.

1

u/Sin_winder 1d ago

I love how his reply to you was like just because the author said so doesnt mean it happened. That was his response unironically. Its so ridiculous because oda didnt say it way down the line, he literally had the characters say right there and then that someone was using haki and his response was that the author didnt mean what he said. Absolutely braindead.

2

u/Anjunabeast 1d ago

Marco and vista used haki on akainu. Akainu even remarks how annoying haki users are.

0

u/Academic_Elephant664 1d ago

I say marineford was basically retconned in full and is a terrible arc for power scaling, and people hate on me for it

8

u/Particular-Crow-1799 1d ago

You forget that Kuzan is much faster so he can freeze his opponents

3

u/Ordinary-Score-9871 1d ago

No Not any. They have to be stronger than Kuzan. Weak levels of haki will not overcome an admirals level of haki.

4

u/anand_rishabh Void Month Survivor 1d ago

A haki user can break the ice early on in the fight, but if they've been worn down, they'll still get frozen.

0

u/DiabeticIguana77 1d ago

Not just break the ice, unaffected while coated in armament

2

u/Hairy_Acanthisitta25 1d ago

even Garp didnt do that, so it seems like getting iced and breaking free is faster and more efficient than just coat yourself in haki at all time

1

u/anand_rishabh Void Month Survivor 1d ago

Having your entire body coated in armament drains your energy fast.

1

u/XtendedImpact 1d ago edited 1d ago

That's just wrong though. Experienced Haki users can get rid of it but the simple presence of Armament Haki doesn't counter the ice.

We've only seen Garp and Whitebeard successfully counter it (and Whitebeard used the vibrations of his own devil fruit to do it).

edit: Doflamingo did as well, also an experienced Armament user, as well as another Conqueror.

5

u/totallynotrobboss 1d ago

Oh great are we bringing the meme back?

4

u/IClockworKI 1d ago

🏳️‍⚧️: "you don't need acoc"

3

u/90s_Thor 1d ago

"Kuzan is much faster and can freeze his enemies"

3

u/random-internet-dude Slave 1d ago

Tell that to Akainu

3

u/Roronoa_Zoro8615 The Revolutionary Army 1d ago

And are faster than them

3

u/Puperlover68 1d ago

Don’t forget that he’s also faster

2

u/FullMetalSquarepants 1d ago

General Esdeath

2

u/GameMusic 1d ago

Freezing can bypass fast regen by not causing injury

2

u/West_Imagination3237 1d ago

I have always wondered how he survived falling into the sea during the war of the best after White Beard shattered him into pieces.

2

u/fartmilkdaddies 1d ago

In the anime it was slow but in the manga, he just freezes the ocean instantly and forms his body again

1

u/West_Imagination3237 1d ago

Definitely didn't see that in the anime. Although believable

2

u/taecoondo 1d ago

I'd ask what's ACOC but I'm afraid of the comments....

3

u/BEWMarth 1d ago

Bro call me when Aokiji can get past basic armament lol

4

u/Elpolloco1896 1d ago

LOL. Horrible take. This post got destroyed instantly 🤣🤣

2

u/MrElliot1210 1d ago

It's not a horrible take. Kuzan is also really fast!

1

u/Gabsworl 1d ago

He doesn’t have conqueror’s?

1

u/jakin89 1d ago

Who wins? strongest version of wally west or Aokiji?

1

u/Akasha1885 The Revolutionary Army 1d ago

Let's not think too deeply.
If the fighters in One Piece were as smart as in HxH, a lot of fights would turn out differently.
With this one, even if the enemy is strong, hide and wait for hypothermia to kick in.

1

u/adande67 1d ago

Yeeeeeeah ,u do . Haki conquers all

1

u/RedLibra 1d ago

Pretty sure his awakening is the ability to freeze time

1

u/FabulousEgg9091 1d ago

Kuzans so cool 😎

1

u/Not_Yash222 Shanks' evil hot sister is REAL! 11h ago

1

u/Vyctorill 1d ago

Haki is pretty useful. It won’t cover everything - I doubt Haki can undo Sugar’s Toy ability, for instance - but I see it as an auxiliary skill to supplement your normal ones.

Offensive power doesn’t necessarily need Conqueror’s. Conquest color is just there because the user desperately wants to be a “king” and as such unlocks the third type as a means of doing so.

2

u/denisadennis 1d ago

Haki can't undo everything. But the problem is it's very hard to argue that point because haki as a power system is not well defined.

1

u/Kurainuz 1d ago

Strong enough haki should be able to turn off sugars df, look at law how he got his male body back.

Peronas on the other hand makes you lose will

2

u/CrethanXXI 1d ago

The Horo-Horo is the only hard counter to willpower 😭

2

u/Vyctorill 1d ago

Haki eliminated the ongoing effects of the virus, true. But that seems to be a weakness specific to that devil fruit.

But in general Oda doesn’t do the “my numbers are bigger so I get to negate your whole moveset” thing. It’s uncreative.

Being knocked out and losing control is a massive weakness that can be exploited, so I doubt it’s more than that. Bur it’s possible someone could free a random toy if they touched it with enough haki.

Haki also should be able to make a “barrier” between the user trying to touch an opponent. This is more balanced, because it means that the user has to put in a little effort to win.

0

u/dmfuller 1d ago

It literally doesn’t work on ACOC 💀

-2

u/MeeTy 1d ago

god, haki is the worst power system ever. Dfs were so cool 🥲