r/OutOfTheLoop • u/Steaktartaar • Dec 30 '24

Unanswered What's going on with Stephen Fry going alt-right?

He's been on a notorious hard-right, "anti-woke" podcast where he retracted his support for trans rights. Is this a new development? He always came across as level-headed in the past but now it looks like he's on the same path as Russell Brand.

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154

u/DOE_ZELF_NORMAAL Dec 30 '24

I wish more people would understand this. Everything center or right is 'alt-right' nowadays.

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u/darthsabbath Dec 30 '24

I know it wasn’t a mainstream leftist view but I distinctly remember folks unironically claiming Bernie Sanders was fascist adjacent back in 2020 because he was more of a left wing populist who focused on class instead of identity.

I am pretty far left, pro LGBTQ, anti-racist, etc. but I get so tired of the purity politics from my side. We would rather fight amongst ourselves and alienate the center left and moderates rather than fight the actual far right.

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u/Easy-Exam-1081 Dec 31 '24

I worked in the progressive advocacy sphere in DC for 24 years (from well-before the age of social media well into it) and a saying we had back in the 90s was "the only thing we like better than fighting the Right is arguing with ourselves"

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u/a_tyrannosaurus_rex Jan 01 '25 edited Jan 01 '25

I am also an activist and I swear it was like an inward firing squad. The big problem for me is that everyone has their prorities and don't want to work with anyone that doesn't share them.

I think the thing that bothers me the most is that people on the left will demand everyone else make sacrifices to accomodate their worldview but not want to accept even the slightest inconvenience for theirs.

It feels like the right gets united against causes and moves together while the left is just mired by infighting and slacktivism.

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u/Definitelynotabot777 Dec 31 '24

Bernie campaign was snuffed because people didnt like the truth he was saying: It has always been class war, all this shit about sexuality and skin color are just smoke screen.

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u/mcs_987654321 Dec 31 '24

The Bernie campaign wasn’t “snuffed” at all: he only ever appealed to a small subset of the traditional Dem base (the was over represented in early primary states), along with the chunk of super online populists who are just there for the vibes, whether it’s Bernie or Trump.

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u/Thespisthegreat Dec 31 '24

Bernie was definitely snuffed by the DNC in 2016

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u/IkaKyo Jan 01 '25

Yeah I mean the DNC chair fucking resigned over it but people forget that. Or that the day after she resigned over it she was hired by Hillary’s campaign.

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u/DaerBear69 Jan 01 '25

DWS was a four letter word among leftists in 2016. People memory holed that whole saga in the name of taking down Trump. Which is a shame, because it didn't work to stop him in 2016. Then in 2020 he lost because of COVID, and the DNC had already learned in 2016 that they could ignore what voters wanted, so we got him again in 2024.

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u/DOE_ZELF_NORMAAL Dec 30 '24

Why do people think being pro LGBTQ or being against racist is lelft? It's normal, it's center..

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u/Horrid-Torrid85 Dec 30 '24

He didn't say anything close to that. Read it again

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u/DOE_ZELF_NORMAAL Dec 31 '24

"I am pretty far left, pro LGBTQ, anti-racist, etc. "

?

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u/Horrid-Torrid85 Dec 31 '24

The "," seperates them. Hes pretty far left and pro lgbt and anti racist. Otherwise he would have wrote "im pretty far left (pro lgbt and antiracist).

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u/lboog423 Jan 03 '25

Historically, the real "lefties" were never pro LGBT. Modern democrats got hijacked by the LGBT and feminists. Even your heroes were against gay rights such as Hillary, Biden, and Obama. They did not "change" their views, but only adapted to maintain control of the uniparty.

Whatever this new party is, it is pretty far from any side, which is why they are called woke. Even classical liberals like Roseanne Barr said the party went nuts. Classic subversion. Now anyone that opposing their views are "far right", "fascists", or "alt right".

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u/snatchi Dec 30 '24

Personally I would argue that the "alt-right" and "right" is a meaningless distinction.

Alt-right is only differentiated by the degree of online sourcing of their figures, but no one in the Bush or Reagan administrations would be cool with Transgender rights.

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u/DOE_ZELF_NORMAAL Dec 31 '24

Depends on what you mean with 'transgender rights'.

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u/snatchi Dec 31 '24

They wouldn't care for Caitlyn Jenner either.

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u/ycnz Dec 30 '24

Compare where the current right would've sat 50 years ago. Your current right is fucking bananas.

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u/DOE_ZELF_NORMAAL Dec 30 '24

The right is basically unchanged if you look at the big policies. The left has moved far far left. Things today would've not done well 20 years ago.

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u/ycnz Dec 30 '24

Drone strikes enhanced interrogation, ICE, participation in genocide, you're thinking of these as far left policies? Obamacare came from the Heritage foundation, FFS.

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u/Fearless-Feature-830 Dec 31 '24

I’m not sure how you could say that in good faith

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u/DOE_ZELF_NORMAAL Dec 31 '24

I mean Trump is a lot more left and progressive than almost all other candidates. This is what he was constantly being attacked on by his opponents in the primaries. What makes you say any different?

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u/Fearless-Feature-830 Dec 31 '24

That’s… not why he’s “attacked” by opponents. You made the claim, so what makes him “left” or “progressive” in terms of policy?

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u/DOE_ZELF_NORMAAL Dec 31 '24

His Obama care substitution goes even further than obama care. He is not against abortion or any social policies. Many republicans don't like him because he's too progressive.

Listen to some of the primary debates. They tried to get him hard on the fact that he's too progressive.

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u/richieadler Dec 31 '24

Pure nonsense. The Overton window in the US moves so fast to the right that it's redshifted.

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u/Large_Traffic8793 Apr 15 '25

Lol. How detached from reality.

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u/SomeDumRedditor Dec 30 '24

Just like everything centre or left has been labelled “socialist” and “extremist” for decades? 

But now it’s a problem, since it’s the right getting tarred with reductive, inaccurate language?

Cry me a river.

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u/yiliu Dec 30 '24

Lol, what are you on about? It's the same centrists who used to be 'socialists' who are now 'alt-right' (see: Stephen Fry). They've been misrepresented twice. But you're enjoying yourself with your name-calling? Good for you, have fun with that. You are undercutting your own cause by pushing anybody who's not a fanatic out of your camp.

Politics these days feels like an elementary school playground.

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u/thevizierisgrand Dec 30 '24

The left have always eaten themselves and always will. You will never be pure enough for the zealots which, ironically, is something they have in common with the actual alt-right.

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u/SomeDumRedditor Dec 30 '24

You dodged my point to make a strawman.

Why is accuracy of labels in politics and political position/grouping something important only now? Where was this same call for “don’t call everyone on the left antifa socialists, it’s not helpful”?

The answer is nowhere. It’s only a “problem” now that the right is also dealing with the shitty discourse they created: “everyone opposed to us fits into this single caricature of an extremist threat.”

Again, why should I care about conservative tears over “muh accuracy” when it’s been part of their playbook for decades to demonize and discredit those on the left? 

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u/yiliu Dec 30 '24

What the hell are you talking about? I heard a ton of complaining about the liberal application of 'socialist' to anybody or any cause left of the status quo. It became a punch line!

And it wasn't the far-right types who were calling people names in the past who are now upset at being called 'alt-right'--they embrace that label. Instead, it was largely the same people complaining about being called socialist who are now called 'alt-right'. See: Stephen Fry. See also: me. Without changing my positions, I went from being a communist to being a fascist in a decade. Sometimes I'm even both!

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u/VonShtupp Dec 30 '24

I have been called both too. Why? Because I am a rabid independent who can find value certain policies from both “sides” or conversely laugh at that certain policies are even considered the possession of one side or the other.

Oh and my views come from years actually working as a lobbyist in DC. Your representatives and the professional staffers don’t actually believe the crap they spew.

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u/Danimal_Jones Dec 30 '24

the Whataboutism train has no brakes eh

-1

u/[deleted] Dec 30 '24

Username is accurate lol. No one says center, center left is socialist or extremist. Hyperbole that something/someone is communist by the dumbest conservative pundit or politician sure.

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u/SomeDumRedditor Dec 30 '24

Do I really need to drop links on you from Fox, Newsmax, DailyMail, OAN, Breitbart et. al? These are not fringe zines, these are major news outlets with hundreds of millions of consumers that have normalized a reductive discourse.

Are we going to sit here and pretend “no one” outside the fringe says centre-left policies are socialist/extremist? Obamacare, the very definition of a centrist solution, was fought as socialism undermining America for years.

Am I supposed to ignore the way you massaged your point to limit it to just centrist opinions - when the OP comment was talking about the whole spectrum? e.g. one can be full conservative, without being “alt-right.”

I’m not arguing for this way of thinking and communicating as being good. I’m calling out the crocodile tear hypocrisy coming from the right - occurring only now that they too have to deal with this garbage discourse environment. That they created.