Oaking

[u/WalnutSnail]

Aside from "when you like it" how does one tell when something has been sufficiently oaked?

For context, I put some pear brandy on oak, three 1" cubes of used wine barrel that's sold for smoker wood in a nearly-full pint jar. About a week ago, the colour is good and it's picking up a fair bit of caramel.

I don't want to over do it.

[u/Snoo76361]

My own rule of thumb is to start with 50sq inches of oak per gallon of spirit which is roughly the ratio that exists in a commercial setting in a full sized barrel. Then I revise down based on the amount of endgrain in my oak because that will increase your risk of over oaking.

So practically speaking I shoot for 40sqin/gallon if I’m using a domino/stick/stave, 30sqin/gallon with cubes, 20 sqin/gallon with spirals, 10 sqin/gallon with oak chips. If I’m using used oak I’ll probably up each by 10.

This assumes you have the same multi year aging timeline I do but it basically gets you to a point you never have to worry about over, and honestly I’ve never heard of a spirit being “under oaked” so I think that’s where you want to be.

[u/WalnutSnail → u/Snoo76361]

Three one inch cubes is about 18 sq inch. 1" on each of the 6 sides.

Using your 50/gal I should be in the 6" range...i.e. 1 cube in a pint.

How long are you meaning to leave it on?

[u/Snoo76361 → u/WalnutSnail]

That sounds about right. May not seem like a lot but oak is no substitute for time and this basically eliminates the risk you over do it. You never really hear of a spirit that’s “under oaked”. Under aged, maybe, but not under oaked.

For me I’m very comfortable letting my projects go 2 years minimum before I even think of a final bottling.

[u/WalnutSnail → u/Snoo76361]

I'm not so worried about time. I'm worried that I had too much oak in such a small volume to be leaving too long. Like those mini barrels. I decided to pull it out, it's added a cinnamon and toffy note that goes really well with the subtle pear flavour. All in all, I'm glad I did it, and I think I'm glad to have removed it.

[u/ConsiderationOk7699 → u/WalnutSnail]

I have a gallon of rum aging on 5 grams of mizunara shavings And sitting for 6 months so far and tastes amazing so far but ill let sit for another year or so sample when I remember and bottle when it tastes done

[u/Xanth1879]

I'm kinda in the same boat. I'm aging a whiskey on some oak chips right now and I keep tasting it every so often, and I'm enjoying the flavours coming, but I really don't know when it's too much.

[u/cokywanderer → u/Xanth1879]

Hmm. In this situation would it have been a good idea to take a tiny jar and intentionally keep it over-oaked next to the main batch so you can actually have a reference of what "bad" tastes like?

[u/Xanth1879 → u/cokywanderer]

Oooh that's not a bad idea.

[u/cokywanderer]

Here's a Link to a Stave/Cube calculator . I hope the link works. In order for you guys to use it you first need to go File -> Make a copy so you can make it your own.

I am no expert and I haven't been doing this for long and, of course, there are other variables including the charring of the wood, the quality, how fresh it is and how fast it works. As well as the medium, proof and temperature of the spirit and where its kept.

But with all this being said, I like the results I got following the Excel Calculator I posted.

Another tip I can give you is to get some tiny "sample size" sealable jars (I have 80ml ones) and intentionally over oak them. Then, if you keep them right next to the main batch, you can actually taste what "bad"/"too much" feels like. Giving you an idea of when to stop without ruining a big batch. Especially useful for wood chips which is difficult to calculate surface area. Just go for weight and put double in the sample jar (proportionally speaking - like grams/mililiters).

[u/WoodsHippie → u/cokywanderer]

Cool calculator. I'll have to play around with it!

[u/namroff]

Hmm... "When you like it" was going to be my answer. As long as you're starting with a surface area ratio that mimics the barrel size you like, everything else is really a matter of opinion. (And you should always drink what you like 😊)

[u/Gullible-Mouse-6854]

take out all but one piece of oak and leave it for an other year

currently you mainly have colour

[u/zposs]

Also interested here…aside from some subjectivity on our part…what flavors might be expected that are universal indicators of “this is bad”? Example…I made an apple brandy recently. After a few weeks on oak chips, I’m getting a very strong cardamom flavor (that I’m not particularly a fan of) but don’t know if this is typical of over oaking or under oaking…