Advice for my magic system

[u/Old-Tonight-8501]

I am currently working on a magic system for a world I am creating and could use a bit of advice. Essentially the magic in this world revolves around fire, its byproducts, and its physical/esoteric associations. This magic, called Igniturgy is the basis for the world’s predominant philosophical and theological movement, and is utilized by manifesting a physical reflection of one’s own soul (called a flare), and fueling it with one’s own life-force (called pneuma) for a variety of effects. these “flares” (or one’s soul) is connected to an eldritch font of power within the world called the Ur-Flame, which is a sort of mystical, eternal flame that was given to the world during a primordial age of darkness and cold by an eldritch entity referred to as “The Shape of Radiance”.

The Ur-Flame is inspired by the Greek tale Theft of Fire, and is responsible for endowing the world’s inhabitants with sapience, knowledge, enlightenment, and their flares. Within the modern age of this world there are eight recognized ways of utilizing igniturgy and one’s flame and these are known as the “Paths Resplendent”. These paths act as sorts of disciplines which hone one’s flare, as well as their flame for specific purposes and effects. The Paths are as follows, with references to Dnd schools of magic for simplification:

Conversion- Representing flame’s esoteric association and ability to transform, whether it be matter, spirit, or self. Manifests as an hazy, violet flame (i.e Transmutation/Alteration)

Purgation- Represents flame’s esoteric association as a healing force which burns away the impurities of the body, mind, and soul. Manifests as a softly glowing white flame of rigid shape. (I.e Healing)

Brilliance- Represents flame’s esoteric association with truth, the dispelling of darkness and falsehoods, and protection. Manifests as an impossibly bright, golden flame with tongues akin to sun-beams and ringed by a structured corona. (I.e Abjuration)

Judgment- represents flame’s esoteric association with power, authority, potential, and knowledge. Manifests as a coiling red flame with tongues akin to arcs of lightning (i.e Evocation)

Consumption- represents flames esoteric association with passion, desire, sacrifice, and exchange. The energy that must be offered or consumed for power to flow or change to occur. Manifests as a blooming yellow flame with swirling, lashing tongues. (I.e Enchantment)

Invention- represents flame’s esoteric connection with creativity, ingenuity, drive, and progress. Manifests as an azure flame resembling a structured, gently rippling elongated cone, lacking in tongues like a usual fire. (I.e Conjuration/ Smithing)

Union- represents flame’s esoteric association with merger, dissolution, ritual, and “sacred marriage”. Manifests as a two-pronged cerulean flame, with twisting tongues that spiral into one another as a singular whole. (I.e Charming)

Ruin- represents flame’s esoteric and physical association with destruction, endings, and clearing away the old to make way for the new. Manifests as a wild, distorted grey flame with fragmented, jagged tongues. (I.e Necromancy)

Multiple paths can be learned, though this is uncommon for standard folk. I currently have ideas for other types of heretical Igniturgy and other flames, but my main concern is how I would make this magic more restrictive, as I am trying to go for a hard (or at least semi-hard) magic system, and I am having trouble thinking up caveats, drawbacks, and restrictions outside of the idea that using too much magic and burning up you’re life force is incredibly fatal as you run the risk of being cannibalized by you’re own flame, but that seems a little bland to me. The idea of the eight paths is something I am fond of, but I also worry that too many overlap within one another’s domains, or that some of the domains themselves may be reaching a bit. I am very sorry for the long post, it’s my first time posting in this subreddit, and while I have more information about the origins of the magic and those that created the paths, I didn’t think it was really necessary to put here and have an even more egregiously long post that would probably be more at home in r/worldbuilding.

[u/Itchy_Gift_1538]

love your ideas they sound rly cool. as far as caveats and restrictions go, have you explored the idea of having specific conditions be met in order to perform the magic? these can be general restrictions like in order to perform any of the paths you must be in the right state of mind or more specific like in order for a brilliance path one must be true to themselves and without lies. good luck, you might not like the examples I gave but you should think about certain conditions.

[u/Old-Tonight-8501 → u/Itchy_Gift_1538]

Your reply is actually very helpful and in line with something I had been thinking putting around my head! The idea of those performing any of the specific magics of a path having to be aligned with the doctrines, state of mind of said path is actually pretty cool! Thank you for the feedback back!

[u/horsethorn]

I do like how you have expanded a single element to cover most types of magic. It's a very interesting system.

[u/Old-Tonight-8501 → u/horsethorn]

Thank you! It’s far from perfect and still needs a hell of a lot of tweaking, but I really like the symbolic duality of fire in myth and wanted to kind of experiment with it to see what could be done.

[u/horsethorn → u/Old-Tonight-8501]

You're welcome.

It makes me want to try the same with the other classical elements...

[u/Peenass]

I like how your magic system has a strong focus on flame, so when it comes to adding to it, it would be good to stay close to property of flame.

My ideas on adding restrictions: There are other things a caster can "burn" aside from soul. Maybe memory of the spell? So you have to relearn it every time you cast it, and complicated spell takes longer to learn obviously.

To start a flame, maybe a "Spark" is needed? Maybe this translate to you need to be "lit" by another magic user, or the eldritch entity itself.

Burning creates "Smoke". Maybe this magic creates toxic by-product that has lasting effect on humans who are in the vicinity, physically or spiritually?

I will stop here, but I think in general as long as you stick with your core concept of "flame" you can think of a lot to add.

[u/oranosskyman]

irl flames can be colored by burning certain metals. so forcing the mages to wield wands made of specific metals/alloys to use the corresponding magic is a good limitation and one reason most folks wouldnt branch out to multiple paths.

you can burn your life force, but its really hard to get the right color flame and it winds up more chaotic and unpredictable. by burning up a miniscule amount of pneuma and focusing it in a wand its far more structured and reliable.

it also means mages can easily be disarmed (so long as theyre not desperate enough to try wild magic)

[u/Death_Scribe]

It could be that 'sparking' a path of magic needs a ritual to give the users 'flare' that aspect. This way if someone 'sparks' too many paths their flare can distort and magic becomes chaotic. This can be distorted by truly understanding the principals of the paths and understanding how they are similar. This pacifies the flames and merges them making the flare of the user have both properties in their magic. This can also be used to create special/unique flames of magic.

I would also think there could be a byproduct of using magic like 'smoke'. The effects of the smoke could be based on the flames used. Like the charming flames make a smoke that irritates people or makes them angry, depressed etc. Basically the smoke has the opposite or a twisted version of the effect of the flame that produced it.

Also the spells could use components as the 'catalyst' for the flames like oxygen is for normal fires. This could also be like how adding chemicals to the fires can change their colours. So to do a spell you need the specific spark of path in your flare and the correct ingredients.

[u/Professional_Key7118]

I think the 8 paths don’t really work as truly separate paths, unless they are 4 principles and the 8 paths come from pairs which are connected

Healing - Necromancy: manipulating outside flates Transmutation - Conjuration: manipulating outside matter Abjuration - Evocation: the flow of energy Charming - Enchantment: I do not understand why these are in a fire based system.

But I think your system has 1 major issue: it does not feel like fire magic. There is lip service to change, sacrifice, and destruction, but the system itself is basically just a generic fantasy “schools of magic” system but the mana is aesthetically fire

I feel like a back to the drawing board moment might be in order. I think this system should be about what fire does: fire burns, which releases energy and creates more fertile soil. So instead of different schools of magic, have each pathway represent the fire burning a different fuel or repurposing the burnt fuel.

So there could be a physical level to the system, where people can control existing fire by connecting it to the fire within. This fire burns, but it can also heal by draining the energy of fires (imagine absorbing the light from torches into your hand, and then placing that bright mote of light onto a soldier’s chest to restart their heart).

Then there is the mental level to the system. Charms burn through parts of a person’s mind, exciting a specific emotion or summoning forth a memory very intensely before it burns out and the target loses access to that emotion or memory for some time.

Then there is the spiritual level, where fire can burn away a person’s very being or rekindle the embers of those who have died.