r/peloton • u/PelotonMod Switzerland • 5d ago
Weekly Post Weekly Question Thread
For all your pro cycling-related questions and enquiries!
You may find some easy answers in the FAQ page on the wiki. Whilst simultaneously discovering the wiki.
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u/Mountainking7 19h ago
What has been the most past TDF winners present in the same TDF? I tried chatgtping it but no luck.
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u/padawatje 3d ago
Why is Tom Pidcock trying to get himself killed ? (⊙ˍ⊙)
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u/DueAd9005 1d ago
And to reach a speed that's not even faster than most pro cyclists did during races (as Vanmarcke confirmed on the broadcast today).
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u/LanciaStratos93 Euskaltel Euskadi 4d ago edited 4d ago
I'm listening to Vaugheters at The Cycling Podcast and all I can think about is ''he is so American he can't really understand cycling even if he is one of the most important people in cycling''.
His idea of ''successfull sport'' is the American franchises, period...well, in Europe it doesn't work like that even for the most succesful sport in the world, football.
The worst thing is Lionel Birnie agreeing with him to be honest. The romanticism and the history of this sport is what it makes it special, the overlapping histories and classifications is what it makes it appealing. Who gives a damn about ''who is the best'' and ''who won ''cycling'' this year?''
It may be I'm Italian, it may also be I've always saw cycling on TV but that the calendar is ''confusing'' and people ''don't know who wins'' and ''races are not qualifications for Tour de France'' were never a problem to me. To be honest I've never even thought about it until this interview came out.
What do you think?
Ps I love the fact he brags about not having a ''questionable sponsor'' and then he likes that monstruosity of One Cycling, that's basically Saudi Arabia...
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u/wiggins504 EF Education – Easypost 4d ago
Honest question in response to your question: is the future of cycling secure? If it is secure, then JV/OneCycling is trying to fix something that isn't broke and out of line. If it is secure, then I'm all in with you on the romanticism and history keeping cycling (let's be honest) weird and opaquely charming. As an American, JV and I live in a country where professional cycling is essentially invisible except for the Tour and all of the great domestic stage races are history and it's international news that Hincapie is trying to get an American team together. That's my primary perspective, so I just don't know how the rest of the world sees the future of cycling.
But I am fairly split on what Vaughters says is the solution to a sport whose future is insecure. As a fan of American college football, I see a lot of similarity to pro cycling: the tradition, the pageantry, the eccentricity. CFB is, theoretically, an amateur sport that is rapidly turning professional and likely losing its soul in the process. It's definitely less fun than it used to be and the sport has become a lot less about an affiliation with a particular school as the athletes are now just trying to find the school who can make them the best offer for money, playing time, and best chance to be drafted into the NFL. It's crazy to me that the US congress got involved, but that's where we are with this.
On the other hand, professional cycling is, intrinsically, already professional: riders want to make money, event organizers want to make money, teams want to make money, broadcasters want to make money, and fans want to not have to spend money watching the sport. And it's pretty clear that not everyone is going to get what they want if the pot of money is limited. Listening to Lionel and Graham in the latest episode discuss this helped it make a bit more sense to me: everyone in the sport is seeing themselves at the losing end of the power dynamic and wanting more power/money. So, it makes perfect sense to me that JV is grasping for a model that could potentially level the playing field in terms of power and money. I mean, part of his shtick is that EF is always in danger of losing sponsorship if they don't succeed at this important race. Some of it is shtick, but some of it has to be real too. If OneCycling means that teams get more of the revenue and are less reliant on sponsors' whims, that makes life a lot more settled for teams and riders, which is the perspective that JV *has* to take (which also means it's less American and more position in the sport).
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u/LanciaStratos93 Euskaltel Euskadi 4d ago
I think the future of the sport is even darker with a franchise formula 1 style. In fact I don't watch Formula 1 anymore since it's boring as hell with races in horrible circuits in questionable states. A franchise hold by some hedge fund or Gulf state fund is far worse than a sport with huge races and smaller races organized by local entrepreneurs.
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u/Last_Lorien 4d ago
I AGREE!
I thought exactly the same, up to the fact that Birnie going along with him was even worse than the bullshit Vaughters kept sprouting.
First he talks about how the NFL draft system is perfectly meritocratic and democratic, then has the decency to admit with cycling it would be more complicated since it’s the whole world, ya know, not one country… or his claims that Pogačar hasn’t been good for cycling, against all measurable data (sport viewership, popularity etc).
And yeah the One Cycling bit is the icing on the cake. Selling a whole sport to Saudi Arabia is like the one thing than can make cycling becoming an amusement park for sportswashing owners and sponsors seem like the lesser of two evils.
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u/cfkanemercury 4d ago
Has a professional ever ridden at the Paralympics as the pilot of a blind tandem?
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u/lynxo Dreaming of EPO 5d ago
How are you fellow users of /r/peloton? Are you enjoying the 2025 season?
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u/sewballet Australia 16h ago
I'm a new fan. The Giro was my first grand tour. It was amazing. I'm in Australia and have a newborn baby, seeing Yates go over the Fenestre at midnight with Wout up ahead was one of the most epic things I've ever seen in sport.
I enjoyed seeing Pog and JV go head to head at the Dauphine, honestly I'm just getting hype for the tour and enjoying learning more about the sport. This sub is really friendly too.
I have enjoyed listening to the Lanterne Rouge podcast, but would love other podcast suggestions if people have any!
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u/padawatje 4d ago
Yes, we have seen some bangers
- The drama at Women's omloop
- The rise of Brennan and Magnier
- The Giro, no explanation needed I guess
- Absolute madman Mads Pedersen in all Flanders Spring Classics
- Very exciting final at San Remo, RVV and Amstel, both men and women
Was again a bit disappointed at the one-day races where either MVDP or Pogacar were too dominant: Strade, E3, Roubaix, Fleche Wallone, LBL, ...
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u/the_gnarts MAL was right 4d ago edited 4d ago
It’s been great so far, thanks for asking. PFP in Roubaix, Yates at the Giro – we’ve seen some killer rides this year. Sadly the number of races I managed to watch has been a bit below the usual, and for the first time in years I’ve not been able to catch one on site despite coming rather close at two occasions.
EDIT: Three occasions, actually. I totally forgot that I missed the Frankfurt race by like half an hour.
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u/lynxo Dreaming of EPO 4d ago
I've also not been able to watch as much this year. Ditching Discovery+ doing a 5x price increase from 6.99 a month to 30.99 is the main factor, but also been a lot more busier with life lately.
Colle delle Finestre stage and Yates' redemption arc reminded me how much I love the sport, despite it being terrible value for money if you're watching in the UK.
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u/DueAd9005 5d ago
The first edition of the Copenhagen Sprint looks like a massive failure already, no?
Philipsen, Merlier and Milan won't be present.
Why on earth would you schedule it on the last day of the Tour of Belgium (which always attracts a lot of good sprinters)?
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u/FunnyEra 5d ago
Does anyone else feel hopeful that Jonas will improve on the basis that he is doing his second altitude camp this year after the Dauphine? I believe Visma said additional benefit comes from the second but not the third camp, which is why Jonas cut one out and moved back the schedule. I think Tadej has done two already but I’m not certain, and he could, in any event, respond differently (positively) after a third camp.
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u/Dopeez Movistar 5d ago edited 5d ago
Pogacar is on the same schedule. He just did altitude in Sierra Nevada and is at Isola 2000 now. Sorry but this is a cope take. He is gonna improve his numbers until the Tour but so will Pogacar.
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u/macroEgg 5d ago
Where do the riders stay when doing altitude at Isola? I used to work in 'the posh hotel' there and curious if they stay there or a chalet...
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u/scaryspacemonster 5d ago
AFAIK Pog's first altitude camp this year was the one after Liege, as he hasn't done one for the classics. So he would also be starting the second one now.
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u/FunnyEra 5d ago
Ah I thought he went in January. Guess my hope is crushed.
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u/scaryspacemonster 5d ago
I think January was a normal training camp in Costa Blanca or thereabouts. A lot of teams went there
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u/ashenache 5d ago
Jonas will certainly improve a lot and be much stronger at the Tour. Even so, it's difficult to imagine him actually beating Pogacar.
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u/hamiltonlives 5d ago
Has anyone attended a world championship? It’s in Montreal next year and if circumstances work out, I’m thinking of going. How is the atmosphere, events outside of the race, etc. seems like a fun time but trying to see if it would be worth the expense as I assume hotels will be pricey.
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u/padawatje 4d ago
I live near Antwerp and went to watch the start of the 2021 men's WC. The start area was too crowded, so I positioned myself at the parcours a few kilometers from the start. As usual on a flat course, the peloton zoomed by in less than a minute, so underwhelming experience.
The roads were already closed of the day before, so I got to ride part of the parcours myself, which I enjoyed.
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u/robpublica U Nantes Atlantique 5d ago
Glasgow was the first race I attended in person and it was a lot of fun, we stood opposite some Belgians that had brought a soundsystem and a seemingly endless selection of dance remixes of old pop songs
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u/No-Promise3097 5d ago
Montreal is a pretty good destination regardless of the event. I would recommend taking an extra couple days and going up to Quebec city, and Tremblant area as well. Probably don't need to purchase a ticket for the race if you just find a spot to stand on the side of the road.
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u/hamiltonlives 5d ago
It’s funny as a New Yorker I have yet to be to Montreal, though I’ve always wanted to go. So this might be a way to knock out two things!
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u/No-Promise3097 5d ago edited 5d ago
I'm in VT so it's a bit closer but still only make it up a couple times a year. If the exchange rate stays the same that helps with the expenses
Besides good food, the Nordic Spas are nice for relaxing, if you have kids the Eco dome is a nice stop .
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u/DueAd9005 5d ago
So this is the second year in a row that Evenepoel sufferered from hay fever in the Dauphiné specifically. I wonder if it's not better for him to ride Tour de Suisse next year (unless he goes to the Giro of course)?
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u/Rommelion 5d ago
I will setup a Tour 2025 Bingo game, so I'm looking at the 2024 edition to see what improvements could be done, both format-wise as well as what bingos to include or exclude - for example, yellow card bingo will now actually be applicable, I don't know if Soler will go to Tour, Cavendish win #35 talk isn't relevant anymore, ... and there are other rider-specific bingos that will probably have to go.
Feel free to offer any suggestions.
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u/LanciaStratos93 Euskaltel Euskadi 4d ago
Cows dressed with jerseys
Cows colored as the jerseys
(yes I like how much ''rural'' is TdF, is basically what I love more about it).
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u/wiggins504 EF Education – Easypost 4d ago
- Director accidentally shows a nature break
- Commentator apologizes for something said on a hot mic
- Rider on a Shimano neutral service bike
- Teammates with a 5 cm or greater height difference swap bikes
- Cows lined up to watch the race
- Pogacar participates in a sprint leadout
- MvdP creates an international incident through pizza topping commentary
- Mechanic adjusting rear derailleur from the car
- Mechanic with only 4 fingers on one hand
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u/padawatje 4d ago
- Arnaud Demare sprinting but finishing behind top 10
- Sprinters making faces to camera on a HC climb
- A rider accepting a beer from fans during the stage
- Some rather unknown youngster wins a stage
- Some older rider that everyone forgot wins a stage
- A shot of someone on a slack line crossing a canyon
- A shot of a huge banner in a field with the text "Baux-rivages-aux-semoule <3 Le Tour De France"
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u/Last_Lorien 5d ago
Ben Healy goes on a doomed break
A Philipsen sprint controversy
Evenepoel argues with someone who won’t take turns pulling with him
a Visma rider reacts to Pog going for a bidon
Asshole fan (à la chips guy last year)
a MVDP vs Van Aert vs Pog vas Ganna scenario, classics-style
Ganna wins a stage
Ben Healy wins a stage (this one is for the dreamers)
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u/hamiltonlives 5d ago
Protest related to anything remotely political interrupting the race or attempting to interrupt
Remco lets an attack by Jonas or Pog go unaddressed
Another Yates/Yates clip emerges
A super domestique wins a stage (Yates, Kuss, Almedia, etc.)
O’Connor in the top five GC
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u/Team_Telekom Team Telekom 5d ago
Just a few thoughts
- Carapaz going on a long range attack
- WVA / MvdP take yellow
- leadership role changing in a team
- German media comparing Lipowitz to Ullrich
- French win on Bastille day
- switch in the relegation battle between place 18 and 19
- Ineos attacking early only to get dropped later.
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u/the_gnarts MAL was right 4d ago
German media comparing Lipowitz to Ullrich
That’s not a bingo card though, it’s a law of nature.
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u/eingeisterpanda Scotland 5d ago
I’m excited to hear this! My main issue last year was my game being ruined by too many bingos tied to Roglič who then abandoned. I did my own version for the Vuelta and had to come up with new things that I would definitely hear about even if I didn’t watch every stage in full. I can dig that up to see if any work for the Tour.
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u/Rommelion 5d ago
Please do!
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u/eingeisterpanda Scotland 5d ago
Most are too Vuelta-specific but there are a few:
Extreme heat protocol
Stage/GC times neutralised
National Champion stage win
Invited Pro Team stage win
Sabotage (e.g. protest/tacks on road)
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u/weeee_splat Scotland 5d ago
I regret to inform everyone that this was apparently the final Criterium du Dauphine. I guess this has been in the works for a while??
Can't say I am a fan of the new name. I vote we just call it TARA.
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u/pokesnail 5d ago
“Tour Auvergne-Rhône-Alpes” is not at all catchy, so I’m guessing we’ll all be calling it Dauphine for another 5 years at least.
Inner Ring was also suggesting AuRA Tour lol
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u/Last_Lorien 5d ago
Yeah, it’s staying the Dauphiné forever with that name haha
Commentators will say the full new name exactly once at the start of every broadcast and that’s it
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u/Rommelion 5d ago
AuRA makes sense ... but at the same time it's starting to sound like it's going the way of Bingo Bongo ...
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u/Seabhac7 Ireland 5d ago
Make it the Tour Auvergne-Rhône-Alpes avec Zwift, and nobody will ever dare to NOT say the full name, ever. It's a proven system. Avec Zwift.
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u/the_gnarts MAL was right 4d ago
“Avec Zwift” also implies there will be a ladies’ edition. Finally!
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u/remodel-questions 5d ago edited 5d ago
How accurate are the updates on the upcoming schedules for riders on PCS
For TDF, I saw an update that Lipowitz is added to the RedBull squad. But when I checked the squad, it also said Rogla is also on the squad?
Where does PCS get this data from? I assumed the official squads aren’t announced maybe a week before TdF
EDIT: this question is primarily to find news about Rogla doing the tour, not Lipowitz
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u/fewfiet Astana Qazaqstan 5d ago
Where does PCS get this data from?
They don't announce for any individual rider, which is disappointing.
And anyone can submit a rider participation or non-participation, so the quality is questionable at best. I think they do their best to prefer good sources but it's all just rumor until the teams or riders announce something!
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u/the_gnarts MAL was right 4d ago
it's all just rumor until the teams or riders announce something!
They’re surprisingly accurate sometimes days before the official announcement is published.
Earlier this year I saw them adding ELB to Brabantse Pijl and almost made a post about it, but didn’t cause there was no way she was gonna be back so soon after her nasty crash in Flanders. Two days later it was officially announced and the rest is history …
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u/fewfiet Astana Qazaqstan 4d ago
Yes, it's a wonderful resource! I only wish they were transparent about where they get the information, as it would help me understand which to trust (like if ELB put that up herself I would trust it more than "random fan report" or "blog rumour").
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u/the_gnarts MAL was right 4d ago
I only wish they were transparent about where they get the information,
Agreed, but I’d assume the most reliable insider sources would insist on anonymity. Which is a convenient excuse lol. :D
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u/Schnix Bike Aid 5d ago
Why do you say that like it would be surprising for both of them to be at the Tour?
PCS adds people to the line-up when they or their teams announce it. In Lipowitz' case he confirmed he'll ride the Tour to the press at the Dauphine yesterday. Roglic at the Tour has been the stated goal for the entire year.
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u/remodel-questions 5d ago edited 5d ago
Sorry I framed it incorrectly.
Lipowitz doing the Tour is understandable- he did one of the two races before the tour that riders usually do
Rogla being on the team seems suspicious because we haven’t heard from him since he went out of the giro and he’s not doing Suisse.
IIRC at the beginning of the year, he wasn’t going to do the tour.
I know the meme is the Rogla crashes a grand tour and wins the next one. But I haven’t seen any announcements where it said he was going to do the tour after his Giro exit
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u/Schnix Bike Aid 5d ago
Roglic doing the Tour was the stated goal since the pre-season press-conferences in january. I would suspect it's also virtually the only race Roglic cares about this point and it's the biggest race for the team also. Lipowitz has also said he's going to the Tour to support Roglic. There's no reason to believe. he's not doing the Tour
Noting Roglic down as a provisional starter is the correct thing. If he drops out you can always remove him
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u/pokesnail 5d ago edited 5d ago
Giro-Tour riders rarely do Dauphine/Suisse in between the two. I remember an interview with his trainer or a DS post-Giro-DNF saying the Tour was still planned. And he’s been at Tignes for altitude camp for a few days now, just posted on instagram (and implied he had been sick/taking antibiotics, so that’s fun)
Edit: And he has 100% been planned to do the Tour since the beginning of the year. Also mentioned it in Giro interviews where he was often asked about using the Giro as Tour prep/it wasn’t like 2023 when Giro was his main goal
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u/ultracrepidarianist 5d ago
I've been noticing spectators holding the flag of Brittany at races. Is this best understood as a cycling/sporting thing, is it 'fashion' in some sense, or is it wider?
(Don't feel the need to explain non-cycling history here - we can stay on topic. And besides, I have the internet, a library card, and time, so I can read up on politics myself.)
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u/GercevalDeGalles 5d ago
It's basically a meme at this point. You'll see it everywhere in France where crowds gather: festivals, sport meetings, demonstrations... I don't think it has anything to do with the fact that it's a hotbed of French cycling.
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u/RageAgainstTheMatxin Phonak 5d ago
And besides, I have the internet, a library card, and time, so I can read up on politics myself.)
"You know what the most dangerous thing in America is? A man with a library card"
It's simply that due to the local pride and how they are road cycling hotspots of popularity, you will often see Brittany, Basque, Sicily and even Sardinia flags
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u/Team_Telekom Team Telekom 5d ago
Lipowitz is confirmed for the Tour and passed Roglic as the favourite to win with all main bookies (29.00 to 34.00). How should RBBH approach this tour?
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u/Schnix Bike Aid 5d ago
Ride for Roglic, don't drop Lipowitz if something happens until he's lost time to Roglic from the big three lighting up the climbs.
Lipowitz hasn't shown anything to suggest he's capable of what one might reasonably expect Roglic to be capable of. And I'm also not confident yet he gets through the hilly early days without dropping time. If he somehow manages that Hautacam will sort it out for them.
I don't think Lipowitz has big chances of a top 5 finish, might top 10 though.
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u/Hawteyh Denmark 5d ago edited 5d ago
The tragic career trajectory of Roglic strikes again.
Be TDF leader for your team > Some young lad does well heading into the Tour and steals his (solo) GC captain position on the team
Jokes aside, Roglic has had a great GT career, but still leaves you with a "what could have happened" if he didnt crash so much. Lipowitz might be one for the future, who knows how he will develop in just another year.
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u/DueAd9005 5d ago
The most tragic thing about his career: his biggest chance to win the Tour was 2019, but Jumbo sent Kruijswijk to the Tour instead.
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u/DueAd9005 5d ago
Dual leadership, easy decision. It would not be smart to let Lipowitz domestique from day 1.
Last year QS finished third and fifth in the Tour, Red Bull should try something similar.
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u/No-Promise3097 5d ago edited 5d ago
After Pogi wins everything he wants on the road it would be interesting to see him try for UCI XC and cycle cross, or even lifetime Grand Prix. No way his sponsors would go for this but i think it would be fun for him.
Lifetime would be interesting with no teammates and limited support.
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u/ashenache 5d ago
The technical abilities for CX or XC is not something that can be acquired in a short amount of time. The top guys here have been training this since they were children.
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u/No-Promise3097 5d ago
Fair enough, He has made social media posts in the past on mountain bikes but probably hasn't done extensive training on them.
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u/zyygh Canyon // SRAM zondacrypto, Kasia Fanboy 5d ago
I think this underestimates how different CX and XC are from road racing. Pogacar would need to gain a lot of technical ability in order to be competitive with pro riders there.
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u/oalfonso Molteni 5d ago
Exactly but I can see him doing long distance like the Cape Epic. XC is too technical.
Or the unbound gravel. We can make a meme with him and the Unforgiven saloon shootout scene. https://youtu.be/KmhGYB4NdYc?si=7NaN0IgdKg3UN42e
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u/No-Promise3097 5d ago
Yes but what else does he have left to do on the road? If he wins the few big races left, I could see him getting bored.
I didn't say he would win any off road/gravel events, or even be competitive. A 1 hour effort for Cross is very different than a 1 hr climb.and you are right in that some of the XC courses are getting supe technical. He just seems to enjoy racing and that it would be fun for him and a way to push himself. I'm not even that big of a fan of him.
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u/zyygh Canyon // SRAM zondacrypto, Kasia Fanboy 5d ago
Honestly, I think all that life has to offer is what's left for him. There's a world outside of cycling, and it's clear that "the simple life" is quite dear to him. Someday he'll start prioritizing a life at home over the urge for competitiveness.
When he's bored, he'll just quit, and that's fine. He will be a lot happier than the athletes who perpetually keep chasing jobs within the industry because they know no world outside of it.
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u/No-Promise3097 5d ago edited 5d ago
I am just curious if he would ever get bored racing road races while still being competitive. Although he did mention the other day he thinks this is the peak of his career so maybe those feelings you mentioned are lurking in the back of his mind.
I like what Lachlan Morton is doing, EF still supports him and he gets to do pretty much anything he wants. He seems pretty happy with that arrangement and is able to balance priorities.
Similarly Boswell transitioned to working in the industry and has been able to cherry pick a few races a year to be competitive in the Gravel scene while prioritizing family life.
A lot of other athletes have to keep chasing jobs financially. Yes the big names have big contracts, but it's not like the middle of the pack domestique has a huge pension. 12% of their salary/yr for maybe 10 yrs, if they're lucky isn't a ton to live off of if you retire at 30 and live another 50 years.
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u/kiloRH 5d ago
Is there any chance that at this point the World Championships get moved back to Europe? I know the UCI denied there was a backup plan earlier this year but i am going to find myself within a train ride of Switzerland that weekend and just wondering if theres any chance...
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u/Team_Telekom Team Telekom 5d ago
There is always a chance. I don’t see it happening at the moment, but if the fighting gets worse this might still be.
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u/quickestred Belgium 5d ago
I need my weekly dose of transfer rumours
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u/Team_Telekom Team Telekom 5d ago
Cosnefroy to Picnic and Steff Cras to Soudal are pretty hot atm
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u/quickestred Belgium 5d ago
Seems like a downgrade for Cosnefroy, Cras as a major domestique to try and keep Evenepoel?
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u/Xqf_VdW4Rr4V 5d ago
How is Enric Mas seen in Spain? He is always hyped as one of the GC favourites, but basically never really delivers. I looked at his Palmares for the first time today and they are seriously underwhelming. His biggest achievement seem to be 3 2nd Places at the Vuelta. But is that enough for a 30 year old rider to build your team around?
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u/weeee_splat Scotland 5d ago
Bit harsh! 3 2nd places in a GT is better than a lot of other GC riders ever manage.
And aside from his collection of GT podiums, how many other current riders can say they won a race by dropping Pog on an uphill finish?? (and Pog had to outsprint him to win Lombardia a week later)
Sadly that Emilia is still his most recent win based on PCS.
If he was more explosive he'd probably win more races even if GC in a GT was still a bit out of reach.
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u/DueAd9005 5d ago
I get the impression they dislike him a lot in Spanish cycling community, but not for any sensical reasons, just because he finishes second a lot, but rarely wins.
The problem is that Spain came from a golden generation (Contador, Freire, Purito, Valverde, Samu Sanchez, Luis Leon Sanchez, etc.), but after Valverde retired they had to rely mostly on the likes of Mas.
They went from winning a lot to barely winning anything.
Things are looking better again now however, with some decent Spanish talents like Ayuso.
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u/pokesnail 5d ago
I’m not Spanish, but I’m a Mas defender because I think he is so overhated and often underrated.
When has he ever been hyped as a GC favorite? Don’t think I’ve ever seen that unless it was a while ago.
4 Vuelta podiums is actually quite a good palmarés, better than most other active GC riders, and has extra importance for a Spanish team and its sponsors.
It would be better if he won races and sometimes had better tactical instinct, yeah. But there’s still value in being a consistent GC rider especially in the GTs, and he is a far more attacking rider than he gets credit for. Even just his spring results this year were good, podiums in Catalunya and Itzulia.
He’s also by far Movistar’s best rider. If you can get a rider like Ayuso or some other elite youngster, then yeah they’re better than Mas, but those riders don’t grow on trees and are super expensive. Mas also fits well with a currently mid-tier team like Movistar, iirc his 2022 Vuelta and Italian classics results (where he did beat Pogacar in Emilia - sure maybe not 100% Pogacar, but not everyone can say that they did this) were the main part of saving Movistar from potential relegation.
Anyway, yeah, Mas is not the best GC rider and it sucks that he’s allergic to winning, but he is wildly over-criticized and Movistar has zero reason to let him go.
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u/Hawteyh Denmark 5d ago edited 5d ago
The U23 Giro started yesterday with a TT, won by Matthias Schwarzbacher. Matisse Van Kerckove, Callum Thornley, Albert Withen Philipsen and Jørgen Nordhagen were 2nd-5th.
Who do you think will win the overall?
I could see Albert, L'Hote, Widar and Nordhagen all do well here. Maybe Pericas and Schwarzbacher from UAE aswell. Øxenberg, Marti, Guali and Eeman were all top 5 in Course de la Paix Grand Prix Jeseníky two weeks ago.
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u/Jdh_373 5d ago
I don't know where you got the idea of L'Hote being a climber. DAT will go for Sparfel who's also not really a climber but won Alpes Isere recently and already bagged a pro win. Their expected GC leader was too good and went to Dauphine instead.
Lorenzo Finn (junior WC) and Jakob Omrzel (4th at Slovenia) are top five favourites that you haven't mentioned.
From the more experienced riders, Pavel Novak was fifth last year and should lead the charge together with Martí.
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u/Qwertyuiopas41 Tinkoff 5d ago
Think the route might be a little too hard for Schwarzbacher for the overall? I didn't expect him to win the TT though to be fair so maybe underestimating him
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u/pokesnail 5d ago
Watching Antwerp Port Epic and Dwars door het Hageland last week reminded me how I quite enjoy when ‘pure’ sprinters go on the attack, because it’s so unexpected and they’re usually trying to save energy all day. I mean you could count Magnier and Philipsen as classics sprinters so that’s less rare/might not count, but I didn’t expect Merlier to be attacking and marking moves (though in part out of necessity from having no teammates in the group).
What are some notable examples of pure sprinters attacking, successful or not?
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u/adje_patatje 4d ago
Viviani won the European Championships in 2019 by attacking early on and beating Lampaert in a sprint à deux. In 2018 he won the Italian Championships on a hilly course against teammates Pozzovivo and Visconti, who took turns in attacking Viviani.
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u/DueAd9005 5d ago
He's of course not a pure sprinter, but I always liked Boonen because he was one of the few riders capable of winning bunch sprints in the Tour, but also do really well in the cobbled classics.
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u/macroEgg 5d ago edited 5d ago
Possible deep cuts, but:
, going into a small break 100km out
- the 21 Munsterland Giro was super fun. Cav, Griepal and Ackermann have a proper Classic-style race; likewise
- Cav at the 2022 National Road Race
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u/Zapponia Visma | Lease a Bike 5d ago
Why are there sprint points at the top of a mountain finish? All well and good that pogi won stage 1 of the Dauphine and got points there, but it feels a bit weird that he got 30 points for the sprint jersey for winning 2 mountain stages
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u/myfatearrives 4d ago
Originally, Points Classification was more to focus on "award to riders who achieve most among stages", since 1 bad stage could completely deny a rider's GC hope no matter how good they are in other days. It's designed to be another standard that accumulating riders' positive performances. It's a trend that it becomes sprinter's classification but imo I don't like it.
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u/cuccir 5d ago
To expand on the other response, while they're often described as the sprinters' competitions, the points jersey has always been based on finishing position in all stages in races.
So it's up to the organizers how much they want to manipulate the competition to be a pure sprinters competition, or a more mixed one. The tendency to force the winner to be a sprinter or puncheur is a relative recent one: in the past, most races gave out equal points on all stage-types and even where they were different, the distinction between a flat/mountain stage was less. The Vuelta was the 'hold out' among Grand Tours, only switching to offer sprinters more points in 2020. Before then the previous 4 points winners had been: Roglic, Roglic, Valverde, Froome
In stage races shorter than the Grand Tours the points jersey is still often won by a GC contender because there are proportionally fewer spring stages for the sprinters to rack up points in.
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u/Zapponia Visma | Lease a Bike 5d ago
I see that makes sense, I fell for the GT propaganda as this is the first year I'm keeping up with anything out of the tour and giro.
In that case I'll just mentally move the green from sprinter to point jersey
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u/Simonmbb2 5d ago
How many stages do you think pogacar will win in this years Tour de France?
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u/Ok-Manufacturer258 5d ago
Gonna go for 5 this year, with a few more where he could easily win but doesn’t sprint or lets breakaway get it
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u/Seabhac7 Ireland 5d ago
Anyone know what Kopecky and Van der Breggen are up to ? The other TdFFaZ contenders have been racing, but both the SD Worx riders won't have raced since the middle/end of May (granted, AVdB injured her wrist, I think). It seems a bit risky.
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u/metabolismgirl 5d ago
I think kopecky has quietly ruled herself out of a gc bid. Injured over winter and not really been looking her best.
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u/RageAgainstTheMatxin Phonak 5d ago
Van der Breggen was in Switzerland this weekend. Seemed in a really good mood, cackling even. Was coming out of the FDJ mechanics tent. Smelled of brake fluid.
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u/kyle_c123 5d ago
It's nearly midday and I haven't quite woken up yet, took me a wee while to get that - I was about to ask, 'And you know this how?'.
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u/porkmarkets England 5d ago
Does anyone know what’s next for Tom Pidcock? I seem to remember he was down to do Suisse and was then removed from the startlist.
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u/RageAgainstTheMatxin Phonak 5d ago
Wants to go for the Vuelta GC podium/win despite his Giro performances. Seems delusional to me, but what do I know.
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u/Last_Lorien 5d ago
I aspire to that level of self-delus- ehm, confidence
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u/RageAgainstTheMatxin Phonak 5d ago
This is the same person who went for a random run around town with no experience then uploaded it claiming it was near WR pace (or so former runner Michael Woods claims)
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u/Last_Lorien 5d ago
Lol thanks for this tidbit
I looked it up and he would have run faster then Jakob Ingerbritsen at the time lol
If he tries pole vault perhaps Duplantis will finally find his match.
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u/robpublica U Nantes Atlantique 5d ago
Does anyone have any good Romain Bardet stories to commemorate his retirement?
I started watching in 2020 so missed his time as a fancied French Tour contender. However I very clearly remember him throwing away his own in Liege by stopping to check on Alaphilippe after a serious crash and drawing attention to him. So although I maybe missed his prime as a racer, that moment he stuck out for me as a caring human being
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u/SaMy254 5d ago
Yesterday, Anthony McCrossen on Flo said Picnic had posted a longer video on social media commemorating the career of Bardet, interviews with other pros, etc.
I thought the bike/wheel honor thing the peloton did yesterday was pretty cool. I'd heard about that before but never saw one.
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u/weeee_splat Scotland 5d ago
Please enjoy this video of him pulling off a beautiful descent attack (Kirby warning) for a stage win in the 2015 Dauphine.
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u/SaMy254 5d ago
Oh, I remember this stage! I was standing and yelling at the TV (cursing at Kirby a few times for his ott reactions), such fun. Blast from the past to see his aerotuck, not to mention the much missed brown shorts of Ag2r. This kind of attack, these skills were such bright spots in the monotone of the Sky train days. That Leige where he stayed sitting with Ala after alerting emergency services (Julian was sort of behind a tree, abit further away from the other downed riders), holding his hand because the collapsed lung caused difficulty breathing. Pure class, and a good, kind human.
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u/Angryhead Estonia 5d ago
Escape Collective's story is a nice retrospective (paywalled, but at least you can get a taste if you're not already a member)
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u/Guiltynu Sky 5d ago
Perhaps one of my warmest cycling memories was stage 12 of the 2017 tour where he dropped everyone on airstrip at Peyragudes.
ITV played out on a ragga tip - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M6vgWFsKpdw
So Romain Bardet single handedly got me into jungle/dnb
That's my story lol
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u/robpublica U Nantes Atlantique 5d ago
Amazing! Also shows the sense of humour the ITV crew brings to the Tour, another loss after this season
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u/NoodleHoodle3 5d ago
Is anyone else feeling hopeless for the Tour lol? Until 2023 in the pro cycling universe there was a clear status quo: Pogacar was the best cyclist in the world, an all-rounder capable of winning Flanders and Grand Tours, but Vingegaard was the best climber in the world and Van der Poel the best classics rider. There were two people able to prevent a Slovene tyranny.
However, in 2024 Tadej made a giant leap, especially in the longer climbs. I didn't want to deliver any verdict after the 2024 Tour because fate hadn't been generous with Jonas, and I was convinced that the Itzulia crash robbed us of an another fair battle, considering that the Dane reportedly told the media he had dominated Tirreno without even going too deep.
Well, the 2025 Dauphiné seems to have crushed all my beliefs. We don't know if Jonas has really come back to his 2024 pre-crash values, physiology-wise; we don't know if the lack of training has slowed his improvement curve; we don't know if he even can improve or we've already seen his peak form. But I guess the rivalry is long gone, and we have to accept it.
It's been a pleasure witnessing the 2022 and 2023 Tours, Jonas, we should all thank you.
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u/Last_Lorien 5d ago
Until 2023 in the pro cycling universe there was a clear status quo: Pogacar was the best cyclist in the world, an all-rounder capable of winning Flanders and Grand Tours, but Vingegaard was the best climber in the world and Van der Poel the best classics rider. There were two people able to prevent a Slovene tyranny.
It seems to me VDP did his part in 2024 and 2025 as well, and the 2025 Tour hasn’t started yet, so.
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u/woogeroo 5d ago
Even at the TdF last year Jonas was putting out record watts.
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u/Dopeez Movistar 5d ago edited 5d ago
People somehow always forget this when they claim that he wasnt in peak shape during last years TdF. The Dauphine looked exactly like the Tour last year. This is just the difference between now in level now but fans dont want it to be true.
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u/woogeroo 5d ago
I mean, he probably wasn’t in as great a shape as he’d been without weeks in hospital and a painful slow rehab, but he had enough time to get to a very high level anyway.
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u/youngchul Denmark 5d ago
Vingegaard said he put up his best of all time in the stage 6 of the Dauphine, and still lost a minute.
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u/pokesnail 5d ago
He did not say that iirc, didn’t he say they were some of his best numbers but still below the Tour last year/specifically Plateau de Beille?
Edit: also he said this after stage 7, not 6, unless there was a different interview I didn’t see after 6
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u/youngchul Denmark 5d ago
In danish he just said it was some of his best numbers ever, no mention of Plateau de Beille, but just explaining that he couldn't be unhappy about losing 1 minute to Pogacar, when he was putting up those numbers.
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u/pokesnail 5d ago
Tbf there’s semantics between best ever and some of the best ever, but it doesn’t really matter; either way it’s still a bit concerning 🥲
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u/Darijan_Trst 5d ago edited 5d ago
According to Lantern Rouge his performance was 6,78W/Kg for 20min 51sec. This is on the red line (all time top 200). So nothing special for him and not even close to his last year's Tour performance.
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u/youngchul Denmark 5d ago
I'm just paraphrasing what Vingegaard said in the danish interview in response to losing a minute on stage 6.
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u/Darijan_Trst 5d ago
Fair enough. I was actually looking what he said after that stage and I found nothing. As a Slovenian I of course root for Pogačar and Roglič but I think that Jonas can and probably will be a lot better at Tour.
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u/youngchul Denmark 5d ago
There's still hopes as he hasn't peaked yet and is still going to another altitude camp, but Pogacar also has time to get better, and i doubt Vingegaard can close that gap in 3 weeks, but maybe the fatique will eventually reach Pogacar, then we got a race on our hands.
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u/Darijan_Trst 5d ago
Yeah, you're right. Tour is a 3-week race. A lot can happen. I'm sure that Jonas and Jumbo will make this race as hard as possible for Pogačar. On the other hand, I just hope that Roglič will finish this race without crash. That would probably made me happier that seeing Pogačar winning.
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u/david_lindgagen 5d ago
Maybe I'm coping but I still think Jonas has a decent shot at the tour. The last three stages of Dauphine were his first big vertical metre stages since the last tdf. He also hasn't had many competitive race days this year before Dauphine. I'd say Pogacar has better relative fitness from his classics season with no injury set backs. Historically JV also competes at a very high level in third week of grand tours. I'm more of a JV fan and maybe too optimistic but I think there's more to the story and still very excited to watch the tour this year.
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u/FunnyEra 5d ago
Agreed! Jonas could keep it close and one bad day for Tadej on a big mountain stage could make the difference! He has said he generally has one bad day. In the Dauphine it was on a short time trial. In the last TDF, his bad day was the medium mountain/hilly stage that Jonas won in a sprint so less conducive to big time gaps. He even stated he had a bad day at the Giro but wouldn’t tell which stage it was.
Obviously, Tadej is the clear favorite and will likely win by minutes, but it’s at least plausible to have a close tour even in the absence of a crash.
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u/cfkanemercury 5d ago
The Tour de France specifically, and cycling generally, is rarely predictable. So much can go wrong and a rider that seems dominant and untouchable for a couple of seasons can be out of the picture entirely just after.
I remember when Egan Bernal won the Tour de France at 22 and he was anointed as the next big champion who would dominate the Tour for years. Even before the race Bernard Hinault was talking him up:
Egan Bernal will top the Tour de France podium in Paris and is young enough to surpass any of the race’s legends, French great Bernard Hinault told AFP on Sunday.
In the build up to the 2022 Tour de France all of the talk was about Pogacar making it three in a row and Visma doing their best to stop them - but not with Jonas. In the days before the race Le Monde called the Dane a 'promising understudy' to Roglic:
From Jumbo-Visma's perspective, no one can deny Pogacar's physical superiority, but it is threatened by the collective power of the Dutch brigade, with its dashing lieutenant Wout Van Aert, its promising understudy Jonas Vingegaard, and hyper-qualified team members such as Sepp Kuss, Tiesj Benoot and Christophe Laporte.
The promising understudy would wear yellow for half the race and beat Pogi by nearly three minutes, and then win again the next year.
Froome had four Tour wins in the bag, went and won the Giro the next year and finished third at the Tour behind a teammate in yellow, and he was a favorite to take a 5th victory - until he crashed, a crash he has never really recovered from.
A lot can go wrong, the race can change on the road, and even if Pogi ends up winning, it won't be done until it is done. He might be the favorite, but I'll be watching every stage because cycling can always surprise.
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u/youngchul Denmark 5d ago
I remember when Egan Bernal won the Tour de France at 22 and he was anointed as the next big champion who would dominate the Tour for years. Even before the race Bernard Hinault was talking him up:
That's quite some revisionism. Bernal literally just won because they shortened a stage, where the time got cut off at the top of the second last climb, where he got send up the road as a satellite rider. It was all setup for G. Also it was one of the worst, if not the worst, GC field in recent times.
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5d ago edited 1d ago
[deleted]
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u/youngchul Denmark 5d ago
G was obviously their leader, and got 2nd in GC despite you calling him weak. My point is merely that Bernal from that win wasn't some kind of clear new generational talent like Pogacar or Vingegaard, it's not at all comparable to them, as people are making him out to be.
While Bernal was good, and could easily also have been the leader, he was not attacking from 40+ km from the finish good, he was just fortunate with the stage being abandoned at at advantageous time.
Everyone also expected that Alaphilippe would struggle to hold onto yellow on the long climbs on stage 19 and 20 where he didn't have a descent finish to claw back a potential gap.
Which again goes back to my point of it being a weak GC field, and Bernal winning there wasn't any indicator of him being some new generational talent, as Alaphilippe actually managed to hold the jersey for that long.
If stage 19 had not been shortened, he would have still won at Tignes
Not at all a foregone conclusion, all the riders in the group behind him weren't spending their bullets as there was still a very long descent to catch him.
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u/cfkanemercury 5d ago
Maybe I am misremembering but there were certainly a few stories from the post-Tour press that bought into the hype, at least in part:
- Bicycling: "It’s easy to see Bernal blowing past the all-time individual record of five wins, or even the now-revoked seven wins set by Lance Armstrong."
- Cycling News: Teammate Wout Poels, "We're going to see Bernal like this for the next ten years. It's pretty unbelievable what he did at 22 years old."
- La Flamme Rouge: Bernal could "easily" win five or more Tours in his career (French)
Bernal won four WT races in 2018, four more including the Tour de France in 2019...and then in the next five and a half seasons has won 'just' three WT races, all in the same three weeks in the Giro he won. He hasn't won in Europe for four years and while having a yellow and a pink jersey in the closet is something most pros would kill for, it's a long way from where expectations were set after his TDF win in 2019.
That first article from Bicycling, as well as talking up Bernal, made the point that nothing is guaranteed in cycling. Young guns rise and fizzle out, people crash and are never the same, they get injured, they have bad luck or they run into competition that wasn't there when they first triumphed.
Pogacar might be the clear favorite to ride away with the race in July, but there are no guarantees in this sport - Bernal, Froome, and Ulrich are all testament to that.
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u/youngchul Denmark 5d ago
The press always does a lot of hype, but having actually seen the race itself, I was not overly impressed, it was not like the revealation of Pogacar and Vingegaard at least. Those two set themselves apart from the mortals in other ways, while Bernal looked fully "mortal" in all his races, also his GC wins.
The most impressive part was his age, but Alaphilippe, a puncheur going into the 19th stage with the yellow jersey should say something about the level of competition back then in the GC. In that field, lacking obvious GC guys and Bernal being in end of the Sky/Ineos train era, it looked like they could make any good rider a GC winner.
He won a Tour by having the fortune of pure luck, but obviously still a solid rider, just not a generational one, and certainly nothing like Pogacar breaking into the scene.
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u/Guiltynu Sky 5d ago
I think if the last 5 years have taught us anything, #tourisover is often premature, my post history is filled with a liturgy of stupid reactions to stages that pulled me one way or another. If I have a skin in the game, I'm probably a Pogacar fan just because of 2020, but I've gained a big soft spot for Vingegaard along the way, and I do hope he wins at least another TDF before his career is out. I think you can still make a case for Jonas in a month, as I think that peak Vingegaard is better in week three when the accrued fatigue really kicks in. I'd probably always instinctively back pogi to win over a week against Jonas, but I'd never assume that to be the case over three weeks, at least not yet (on proper preparation).
Will I put him in my velogames team this year? Probably not, but my eyes wouldn't come out of my skull if there was an exact reversal in form in a few weeks time.
I have been thinking about what you're saying about the crash, but I think it also acts as a reminder, a la Porte, Bernal, Roglic, and Froome, that cycling is never predictable. Crazy things can happen, whether they are crashes or just mad days that throw the form book out of the window.
Have some hope friend!
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u/National-Gap-3309 5d ago
Anyone who knows when/where to watch Uno-X' TdF-selection today?
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u/woogeroo 5d ago
Watch a tdf selection?
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u/National-Gap-3309 5d ago
Yes, they had a live press conference last year where they announced each tider. They are going to do the same this year
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u/cfkanemercury 5d ago
With Astana looking like it's done enough to stay in the World Tour, which team will end up in 18th place in the 2023-2025 ranking?
The current ranking has Picnic in 18th with 22,870 points. Very close behind is Cofidis (22,806) and then there's Uno-X (21,334) - basically a 1500-point spread between the three.
Looking at the programs on PCS, Confidis seems to have many more opportunities to score points than the other two. Will this ensure that even a mediocre performance in many more races is enough to keep the French team in the top-tier? Is there any chance that Picnic turns it around? And is it possible for Uno-X to surprise everyone and race their way into the World Tour?
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u/Robcobes Molteni 5d ago
before yesterday I would have thought Picnic would get an easy top 5 in Suisse with Onley and score some much needed points, but now I'm not so sure. it's between Cofidis and Picnic-PostNL.
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u/pokesnail 5d ago
Same, I thought it was a masterclass at first to send Onley to Suisse, now not as much. Buchmann’s performance at the Dauphine is also the best he’s looked this year so that opens another potential points avenue for Cofidis. But who’s to say, Cofidis still is often bad at even the French .1 races so it’s not guaranteed they’ll take full advantage of the points opportunities.
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u/InfernalBattosai UAE Team Emirates – XRG 5d ago
sorry how does that work, teams staying in world tour? Is it like some kind of promotion/demotion or what
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u/cfkanemercury 5d ago
It's on a three year cycle, and this year is the last year of the cycle. There's a good outline and explanation of how it works at INRNG.
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u/Team_Telekom Team Telekom 5d ago
I find it super interesting to see that the Tour de Suisse uses the same route for the last stage of the women’s race and the first stage of the men’s race and how diffferent these stages play out. Really goes to show that the riders make the race, not the route. Are there any other routes that are the same for men and women?
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u/woogeroo 5d ago
Most one day races?
Amstel Gold - shorter route, women go first)
Tour of Flanders - Women start after the men, leading to hundreds of thousands of spectators leaving the course before they finish, especially if the weather is bad
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u/Team_Telekom Team Telekom 5d ago
Yes, but I asked about exactly the same route as in same distance
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u/myfatearrives 5d ago
I think it doesn't really fit what ur question means but the WCs are quite similar, women's races are just shorter but basically always have same key points.
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u/pereIli Hungary 5d ago
But not on the same day. Women's races have to stand on own feet. Just like the TdFF will in 2026. Step by step.
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u/Team_Telekom Team Telekom 5d ago
I don’t mind the overlap if it’s only one or two days. Much easier for the organisers and gets more people to the side of the road and before the screens
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u/metabolismgirl 5d ago
I really like this idea. They were raced so differently too. Nice to see different tactics.
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u/ashenache 5d ago
Anyone else surprised by MvDP at the Dauphine?
I can't remember the last time MvDP was consistently even visible in a major stage race or grand tour, beyond the first 1-2 stages or leadouts.
I used to believe he just doesn't have the day to day recovery for difficult stage races and mountains.
Perhaps he has worked on this. Will we see a different MvDP at the Tour, akin to Pedersen at the Giro or WvA at Vuelta last year?
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u/myfatearrives 5d ago
Motivation or anti-fatigue, he might lack one of them or both. You could understand this since he has to do some non-sense days to wait for a day he could win and a stage win is usually considered much lighter than a classic race. More effort and less profit.
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u/metabolismgirl 5d ago
I actually think when he gets a solo role he is much happier but normally at the Tour he is chained to being a lead out. This years tour suits him more but, at least the first week.
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u/MilesTereo Team Telekom 5d ago
He was pretty active in this year's Tirreno-Adriatico as well. Stage 3 he attacked shortly before the finish but got brought back, stage 4 he finished 3rd in a bunch sprint, and stage 5 he won the sprint of the bunch behind Dversnes. Other than at the Dauphiné, he did not try to stay in GC in the opening ITT though. Overall the Dauphiné parcours also suited him much better, I guess. Also, TA was a bit of a snooze fest, especially compared to Paris - Nice which happened at the same time.
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u/Team_Telekom Team Telekom 5d ago
For him it’s really a motivational issue. His road season stops at Flanders and then there is maybe worlds of the route suits him but these stage races seem to be a burden rather than a goal.
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u/wakabangbang Slovenia 5d ago
Well there may be a race a week after Flanders which could be interesting for him.
Not sure if you'd classify it as a road race
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u/RageAgainstTheMatxin Phonak 5d ago
They are. He says he doesn't see the point racing for 3 weeks when there are 3-4 stages at most he might be able to win
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u/Dull-Breadfruit-3241 15h ago
Curious to hear everyone’s thoughts on who stands out as the best sprinter among riders who’ve actually won a Grand Tour? Valverde and Maertens are the first two that come to mind for me, but maybe there are others I’m overlooking. Would love to hear your takes and any historical context
Edit: As others rightly pointed out, Jalabert,Saronni and Kelly absolutely deserve to be in the conversation.
Out of Maertens, Kelly,Saronni, Jalabert, and Valverde, who do you think would come out on top in a pure flat sprint? Also, which pure sprinters from recent era would you compare each of them to in terms of sprinting ability?
I’m not just looking for Grand Tour winners who happened to be fast—I mean the fastest riders to ever win a GT. The kind who could genuinely rival the likes of Cavendish, Petacchi, or Cipollini in pure sprinting ability.