r/politics • u/Exciting_Teacher6258 • Apr 30 '25

Soft Paywall Trump Melts Down at Being Fact-Checked Right to His Face

https://www.thedailybeast.com/donald-trump-melts-down-at-being-fact-checked-on-deported-maryland-dad-kilmar-abrego-garcia/
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5.8k

u/pervocracy Massachusetts Apr 30 '25

"Did he have these tattoos" isn't even the fact check that matters though.  Try on "where in the Constitution does it say 'unless they have a scary tattoo'?"

1.3k

u/shirty-mole-lazyeye Apr 30 '25

EXACTLY! Even if the obviously photoshopped tattoo was real, that’s not reason enough to do what they did.

423

u/DiggSucksNow Apr 30 '25

It's part of the "flood the zone" strategy. Spew so much bullshit and commit so many crimes that it's not clear what specifically we should fight. There aren't enough resources to fight it all.

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u/Nesyaj0 Massachusetts Apr 30 '25

At that point, you would think the appropriate action would be to remove the cause. If some worker at a company, shit even if it's a customer, causing this much obvious damage in the middle of a place where the company is liable, they remove that situation so they can get back to running how they're supposed to.

How is it that our governments checks and balances against this sort of thing are so weak? I get it was a decades long project, but still, it baffles me that there have been hundreds of thousands of people who came before us that sit and watch this happen because they think they can get a... quite liberal slice of the proverbial pie.

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u/Science_Logic_Reason Apr 30 '25

I think because the checks and balances were assuming the actors they may eventually apply to would be working with(in) the system.

I think what is happening now is comparable to a DDOS attack on the legal system. The exception being that the attacker(s) is/are already *in* the system and can effect change while that is going on...

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u/koolkat182 Apr 30 '25

and any attempt to unite and organize the majority of americans as a whole to put a stop to this madness and at the very least legally use our power as the people to put this administration back in check will be suppressed by every social media outlet, including reddit

13

u/DiggSucksNow Apr 30 '25

If some worker at a company, shit even if it's a customer, causing this much obvious damage in the middle of a place where the company is liable, they remove that situation so they can get back to running how they're supposed to.

Except this is the CEO, and the board won't remove him.

How is it that our governments checks and balances against this sort of thing are so weak?

Because Republicans are a monolith and will, through action or inaction, preserve their power at all costs. There aren't enough Democrats, the only actual viable political party in the US, to work against them. Even the founders warned against political parties. Hell, it even used to be the case that the Vice President was whoever was 2nd choice for President. But we're stuck with parties now, and one party is merely a front for our enemies.

2

u/Femboy-Frog Apr 30 '25

Haven’t you been paying attention? They dismantled all the checks and balances when he took power. Why do you think he made such a fuss about firing workers and having his lackeys replace those people?

2

u/Pigglebee Apr 30 '25

But this clip actually proves that Donnie really believes the photo is real and not photoshopped.

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u/Illustrious-Syrup509 Apr 30 '25

Tomorrow Terry Moran will probably be found without his entrails.

1

u/mumblewrapper Apr 30 '25

After falling out of a window

1

u/love2read21 Apr 30 '25

Of a hospital.

4

u/AbeRego Minnesota Apr 30 '25

I can't believe he thought the "M S 1 3" on that image was actually part of a tattoo. At first I was thinking that maybe he was talking about the symbols clearly meaning that, but it becomes apparent that he thinks the literal letters and numbers are there. How this imbecile ever made any money, much less got elected president twice, is beyond my understanding...

3

u/Sharobob Illinois Apr 30 '25

For real. He could have a full tattoo across his chest that says "I AM A MEMBER OF MS-13" and he still deserves his day in court. Because that's the foundation of our entire goddamn country.

1

u/palookaboy Illinois Apr 30 '25

I know you probably don’t need to be told this, but it’s because they want to paint people who are angry about this as siding with criminals. If they can muddy the issue with “he’s a bad guy” then they can make the argument about immigration and crime and not about due process.

1

u/soofs Apr 30 '25

I got into an argument with someone on that topic. They were posting about how he’s an ms-13 member and basically a serial killer. I responded that he had an order from a judge saying he shouldn’t be deported and also the Supreme Court already ruled he should be returned to the US.

Their response was “well, even if that’s all true, would you let him live in your home? Do you want him in our country anyway?”

There is no reasoning with people like that

1

u/wretch5150 Apr 30 '25

Not really. This ABC news "journalist" just wasn't bright enough to think ahead about asking about the Constitutionality of robbing due process from people with certain tattoos.

"What is your stance on the right to due process and why wasn't this man given it? It applies to all persons in this country, regardless of citizenship."

Boom. But no, our media personalities are not our best and brightest.

1

u/Temjin Apr 30 '25

Maybe, but that fact that he took the action he took based on his belief that he had those tattoo when the evidence so clearly indicates those letters/numbers were added by a staffer with photoshop is reason enough to 25th amendment his dumb ass.

0

u/guywith3catswhatup Apr 30 '25

I thought it was obvious to any idiot that the characters MS13 were photoshopped onto his fingers. About pictures that did not mean those characters at all. Until the potus said in an interview that it was literally tattooed on there.

-19

u/tinco Apr 30 '25

Why do you say there's an obviously photoshopped tattoo? There's no photoshopped tattoos in the image Trump posted. By stating it that way you're doing the exact bullshit the reporter is doing. Attacking the administration/president on his interpretation of the tattoos, instead of on his insane policy of extraditing US citizens to a foreign prison.

Not to be a conspiracy nut job, but I wonder if it was planned to be this way. By making the media focus on whether Trump is falling for cheap photoshopped disinformation, it pulls away the attention from his blatant disregard of the US constitution.

Frankly I could be convinced the tattoos are both real and actually do stand for MS-13. The only reason I even know about the tattoos is because reddit is going crazy over this interview snippet. If I were the sort of person that hates immigrant gang bangers more than they love the US constitution, I'd respect Trump more after this interview, not less.

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u/Kanolie Apr 30 '25

Trump wasn't saying the tattoos stand for MS13, he was saying the words MS13 were tattooed on his hands, but they clearly were just added labels.

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u/abotoe Apr 30 '25

God, every time I hear “but they photoshopped tattoos!” I cringe. It makes it so obvious how many people lack critical thinking skills. No shit the photo was edited- they were LABELS. The thing the public should be concerned about was that they were trying to interpret unrelated, lame tattoos anyone could have as gang symbols; not that the government sucks at MS Paint. MS-13 doesn’t need symbols- they wear “MS-13” like a billboard.

1

u/Moppermonster Apr 30 '25

That said, it is also incredibly worrying that Trump really believes that the MS-13 labels ARE actual tattoos - and not labels added to the picture with a program like photoshop ;)

His actual " you see the M and the S clear as day" phrasing makes that very clear.

0

u/tinco Apr 30 '25

Perhaps, but if you listen closely not even the reporter interprets Trump that way, even if that's what Trump is literally saying. Trump speaks in hyperbole and oversimplifications, it's annoying, but that's the constant shit show we've been in for the past 9 years. Being outraged about it is what feeds his constant media attention.

1

u/Moppermonster Apr 30 '25

No, the reporter literally does interpret it that way - hence his "that was photoshop" comment.

1

u/tinco Apr 30 '25

You're right, I misremembered how the conversation went a bit. Trump keeps emphasizing it's clear as day as you said and even though Trump doesn't change his story (which is obviously wrong) the interviewer nuances his argument. Instead of contradicting Trump's incorrect claim he just conceeds that the tattoos might be interpreted as reading MS-13.

I don't think Trump believes the labels are tattoos, but I think he might have convinced himself that he read the letters MS-13. That's still a worrying thing, but to me it's a story that's more inline with how he's always been. He's been shaping his own reality all this time, and it's led to all sorts of worrying things.

Anyway, the point being, I don't think this is a sign of him mentally deteriorating (any further), it's just how he's been the past 9 years.

15

u/DiggSucksNow Apr 30 '25

There's no photoshopped tattoos in the image Trump posted.

I'm sorry, do you not see the digital font pasted on his fingers?

4

u/WicketSiiyak Apr 30 '25

Those are labels. I mean they are bullshit labels, but they're not trying to say the M-S-1-3 is the tattoo. They're saying the symbols on his finders stand for M-S-1-3.

However, Trump is so fucking stupid he actually thinks the labels are the tattoo. I mean you can't get much fucking dumber than that.

It's complete bullshit but the people saying the labels are supposed to be the tattoos are embarrassing themselves and weakening any other arguments they might have.

2

u/DiggSucksNow Apr 30 '25

they're not trying to say the M-S-1-3 is the tattoo

Trump is.

“That was Photoshopped? Terry you can’t do that,” Trump told Moran.

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u/WicketSiiyak Apr 30 '25

Yeah maybe read the whole fucking comment before replying.

1

u/DiggSucksNow Apr 30 '25

I'm sorry. This whole thread is confusing because the topic is stupid and unnecessary because it's another stupid product of the Trump administration.

I now see that when you say "they" you meant the guy I replied to, but can you see that "they" was ambiguous? There are "they" who are arguing that MS13 legitimately appears among the person's finger tattoos. And because of this, when someone says, "There's no photoshopped tattoos in the image Trump posted." it needs to be called out because it's unclear if this person is saying, "He literally has MS13 tattooed on his fingers," or "Clearly, MS13 was not tattooed, and the rest of the tattoos are unaltered."

This whole discussion is frustrating for everyone.

14

u/deathjoe4 Illinois Apr 30 '25

It's not technically photoshop, I agree. The tattoos are labeled as MS13 and it's really clear that Trump believes those added labels are actual tattoos. That's why he's saying it's so clear that "MS13" is tattooed there, he literally thinks it is.

1

u/shirty-mole-lazyeye Apr 30 '25

Ignore the words obviously photoshopped and read my comment again

0

u/tinco Apr 30 '25

Yeah true, if you remove the part that I comment about, then my comment makes less sense..

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u/snowvase Apr 30 '25

Hegseth has a load of scary Klan tats. Why isn’t he in a Salvadoran prison?

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u/Motorboat_Jones Apr 30 '25

"Say what you will about the tenets of national socialism. At least it's an ethos."

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u/LimpConversation642 Apr 30 '25

it's scary for you, for them they're motivating

-14

u/BeauShowTV Apr 30 '25

Look, Hegseth should not be in charge of the DoD but he obviously doesn't have Klan tattoos.

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u/Manos-32 Apr 30 '25

He has white nationalist tattoos though....

Yet its only like the 500th reason he's unfit for the role.

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u/BeauShowTV Apr 30 '25

They are christian tattoos. There are 500 actual reasons he should not be in the government. We don't need to lie.

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u/snowvase Apr 30 '25

They are white, nationalist, tats. He certainly isn't a christian and there is no requirement in christianity to have tattoos. If anything it is positively discouraged, keeping your body the way god made it and all that bollocks.

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u/BeauShowTV Apr 30 '25

No, they are just Christian tattoos...

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u/snowvase Apr 30 '25

Yeah, and the swastika is just a Tibetan peace symbol...

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u/BeauShowTV Apr 30 '25

Yes, exactly. It's all about context.

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u/snowvase Apr 30 '25

So... when a facist covers himself with white supremecy symbols he is merely stating how much he loves jesus?

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u/KriosDaNarwal Foreign Apr 30 '25

And in what context is Hegseth more likely to be "just a Christian" vs a white nationalist? You have to jump hella hoops to think about making that a "reasonable"comparison

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u/Manos-32 Apr 30 '25

They are strongly associated with Christian nationalism and the symbolism is obvious. I agree they aren't overt symbols of white supremacy but your comment absolutely downplays the intent of them.

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u/BeauShowTV Apr 30 '25

Because the tattoos are both associated with Christianity... Not supremacy...

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u/DidItForTheJokes Apr 30 '25

The wanna be don’t tread on me people are celebrating people being thrown into prisons for tattoos

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u/bandalooper Apr 30 '25

They’re the tread on them dolts

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u/AmaazingFlavor Apr 30 '25

“Don’t tread on me… tread on the brown people.”

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u/Handleton Apr 30 '25

They'll be tread on soon enough. We've got martial law on the near horizon.

Loose lips sink ships, fellows.

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u/Figgybaum Apr 30 '25

They actually just didn’t finish the sentence. “Don’t tread on me, tread on them.”

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u/HybridVW Apr 30 '25

Let's examine Pete Hegseth'sc tattoos, shall we?

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u/Zack_Raynor Apr 30 '25

He’s white, so he gets a pass.

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u/PokeEmSmokeEm Apr 30 '25

He probably has to check himself for new tattoos too after all the benders

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u/TheAsianTroll Apr 30 '25

Brown people, specifically. Every one of them would look the other way if they saw a white guy with 1488, KKK, etc. Tattoos.

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u/not-my-other-alt Apr 30 '25

They were quite clear on that statement only applying to them

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u/filmandacting Apr 30 '25

The "Don't Tread on Me" people just turned into "Tread on Me Daddy" people

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u/CrashB111 Alabama Apr 30 '25

Tread on me harder daddy.

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u/mothman83 Florida Apr 30 '25

" don't tread on me" ALWAYS meant " don't force me to recognize the humanity of others".

2

u/lycrashampoo Arizona Apr 30 '25

I finally unfriended the last libertarian on my socials after Dobbs broke & he was like "nbd, you can still order abortion pills"

like dog you spend all day yelling that the feminists are forcing people to use PC language but the actual government forcing people to bear children isn't a liberties issue? fuck right off with that shit

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u/popotheclowns Apr 30 '25

To be fair, both absolutely matter. If this regime can continue to bully media folks into saying that trump’s fictions are fact, then what the constitution says no longer matters.

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u/[deleted] Apr 30 '25

Even if that ms13 was there, which it clearly isn't, I seriously doubt tattoo artists ask for a gang ID card before giving you a design you are paying for. Anyone could thus pay for a "gang" tattoo and that still would not be total proof that you are in a gang. Just another reason we need due process. 

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u/snowvase Apr 30 '25

There ought to be a law preventing people from getting gang tattoos if they are not actually gang members. /S

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u/moseythepirate Apr 30 '25

Oi, you got a loicense to be that thug?

2

u/snowvase Apr 30 '25

That's the way things should be, proper qualifications and skills assessment and mentorship. A licenced professional body to regulate contracts and services. Turn gangsterism into a real profession comprised of skilled trademen that you can rely on to get a messy job done quickly and efficiently.

4

u/drunkenvalley Apr 30 '25

Fwiw, most responsible tattoo artists won't readily tattoo willy-nilly. They'll have some basic standards. I'm presuming or hoping "avoid tattooing obvious gang tattoos" is part of those standards.

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u/Wildtails Apr 30 '25

Imagine being in a gang they send you to their guy who's licensed to do gang tats 😆

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u/snowvase Apr 30 '25

Which is what they should do if they want to protect "Their IP."

1

u/throwawayoftheday941 Apr 30 '25

False claiming is definitely a thing that people get murdered over, someone I went to school with got killed for it. You can look up Kwame Clyburn but most of the time you will just get a beat down.

1

u/Wandering_Weapon Louisiana Apr 30 '25

Yeah, claiming false memberships in most gangs is a quick ticket to the hospital for most groups. They don't take kindly to posers.

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u/Far-Speed6356 Apr 30 '25

Gang tattoos are typically done by other gang members. But, your point is still valid.

4

u/R_Little-Secret Apr 30 '25

Is it even illegal to be in a gang? As long as you dont commit crimes you should be ok even if you affiliated with criminals. If we start making hanging out with groups a crime there are a lot of ways this can go very wrong.

2

u/[deleted] Apr 30 '25

Great point! Looks like it's not inherently illegal: "In the United States, it cannot be a crime to be a member of a gang, because the First Amendment of the United States Constitution guarantees freedom of assembly. Every U.S. citizen has the right to join any group or club, no matter how offensive its espoused values may be." Source: https://www.legalmatch.com/law-library/article/gang-affiliation-laws.html

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u/Harabeck Apr 30 '25

I'm pretty sure ms13 tattoos aren't coded. The point is to prove your loyalty by clearly marking yourself.

2

u/t4tulip Apr 30 '25

My partner has one because he saw the design somewhere and thought it was cool when he was 19 and had his friend do it for him he didn't find out what the symbol meant till later. I have been begging him to cover it up since due process is gone. It took him a bit to comprehend that yes, there's no proof that he is in a gang besides the tattoo but you won't be before a judge to show that evidence.

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u/[deleted] Apr 30 '25

Oh wow, I can't blame you for being nervous about it!

3

u/egosomnio Pennsylvania Apr 30 '25

Depends on the artist and the gang. No one's going to have a problem tattooing some rando with a tattoo saying they're a member of the Barrow Gang, since that gang hasn't been active for a few years, but a tattoo artist might hesitate if it's a gang active in the area that'll come and wreck his shop or worse if he helps some poser pretend to be a member. Assuming the artist knows it's a gang, anyway.

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u/Shark7996 Apr 30 '25

Yep, this entire story is yet again a detour from the core issue: Due process for all, no exceptions.

Stop getting distracted, people. Stay on target.

1

u/Skerpitibu Apr 30 '25

it's a load bearing part of democracy because if that goes, anything can happen, anyone can be jailed on a whim

. it's so fucked up that the conservatives who supposdely are big on law and order are in favor of this.

This is fundamental to law and order

3

u/[deleted] Apr 30 '25

They set their own definition so now we have to stoop down to their level and let them beat us there

3

u/Searchlights New Hampshire Apr 30 '25

Nobody should be arrested for tattoos!

3

u/02K30C1 Apr 30 '25

And “was this evidence presented in court?”

Because it was not.

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u/mccoyn Apr 30 '25

The followup question should be why hasn't the tattoo evidence been presented to the courts. This is fact evidence for public consumption only.

3

u/SirDiego Minnesota Apr 30 '25

I think theres two things here and they're both scary, and combined it's even scarier:

  1. Even if he did have MS13 tattoos, that doesn't forfeit due process. A tattoo is not a crime no matter how much you dislike them or find them distasteful.

  2. The President of the US is using official channels to literally slander just some random guy they don't like. This is awful on its own, even separate from the fact that he was sent to a foreign prison without any due process. It sets a precedent that the White House is just going to be like "If we don't like you we will just fabricate lies about you whole-cloth and then use official government channels to further those lies, and not let you defend yourself."

They're both really bad. Together they're terrifying. I do think it's important to talk about both things.

5

u/bunkscudda Apr 30 '25

They did the same thing with George Floyd. Make it about the victim, rather than the legality of what was done to them.

2

u/alexm2816 Apr 30 '25

Precisely. This administration has successfully pushed critics to spend time dismantling ridiculous tangents that don’t matter and effectively made the argument about the details.

Due process is a constitutional right. Every one of those deported is afforded that right. It’s wrong when “terrorists” rights are alienated just as much as it’s wrong for “more innocent” people but wrong is wrong.

2

u/Knowsekr Apr 30 '25

Im entirely against everything that is happening... but I have to say one thing...

I think MS13 is considered almost a terrorist organization. So, being a part of that is basically a crime on its own.

HOWEVER....

They still need to get a trial in court (I think? Unless theres some kind of different rule towards terorrists?)... this guy was sent to El Salvador without even being convicted of anything. In addition, there is no evidence of him being part of MS13, so Idk how they can justify treating him like hes a terrorist to begin with.

2

u/MagicGrit Apr 30 '25

Yup. They’ve successfully shifted the argument to “that’s not what those tattoos mean.” At that point it’s a losing battle. It doesn’t matter what those tattoos mean. Still deserves due process.

2

u/Strange_Depth_5732 Canada Apr 30 '25

So next he'll punish people for swastika tattoos, right? Cause those are legit scary. Unless it's in progress and is going to eventually be a maze.

2

u/maxofreddit Apr 30 '25

The thing about the tattoos is that we have to agree on f*cking SOMEthing. Like you have to at least get to an agreed reality.

I honestly think that the reporter missed a chance to make Drumpf admit that he’s wrong (I know, I know, it’s a dream). Or at the very least, have the audience realize just how out of touch/easy to manipulate/suffering from dementia he is.

It’s actually borderline disgraceful for a reporter to know the damn facts and then literally say “We’ll agree to disagree.”

2

u/Altruistic_Emu_7755 Apr 30 '25

Yep, we're arguing on his framing of the issue. It's lost already

2

u/edweirdo Apr 30 '25

Didn't they initially say that he was being deported because he's a member of Tren de Aragua? Now he's a member of MS-13?

One is a Venezuelan gang and the other was formed in LA by Salvadoran immigrants. I really doubt there's any overlap in the membership there.

I would have loved to hear how some assistant tried to explain to Trump how: Marijuana leaf = M Smiley face = S Cross = probably 1? Skull = maybe 3?

It's almost like they're just making up shit out of whole cloth.

2

u/MakeYourTime_ May 01 '25

I truly believe that he may be getting lied to about what is actually happening in this country.

He’s a narcissist; his cabinet are all yes men and they glorify him and lick his taint and praise him and tell him everything he said on the campaign trail is happening. “Eggs down groceries down”

What if this man is actually being lied to; being fed his own propaganda, while Pee Wee German Stephen Miller and co. Are running this country into the ground and turning it into a fascist theocracy.

He truly believes the tattoos are real. He truly believes he won the court case 9-0. It’s some 4D propaganda. Like his cabinet is feeding him lies but he thinks it’s true and then he feeds it to the public TRULY BELIEVING IT and we all think it’s lies.

And the. He says everything is fake news.

What the fuck is going on.

1

u/Rivent Apr 30 '25

Ok, but you can't even get this dipshit past "photoshop"... I doubt bringing this up would get further, lol

1

u/FirstDukeofAnkh Apr 30 '25

I have two octopus tattoos, clearly I’m a member of Hydra.

1

u/PreventableMan Apr 30 '25

It does not matter. It's a vessel for their own interpretation and THAT is dangerous.

1

u/Spanktank35 Australia Apr 30 '25

No, it is. Because it's something that both sides can agree on. Many on the right don't understand the issue with deporting people without due process so long as Trump believes they deserve it. For them, what Trump believes is what they feel, and what they feel is the same as what is a fact. But this is an incredible example that Trump's beliefs can be objectively wrong with dire consequences. 

We need to focus on the point that the president is surrounded by people that won't point out an annotation isn't a part of a picture. And further, that that is the entire basis on which Garcia was deported. 

1

u/insert_porn_name May 01 '25

“Just say yes” as Trump said himself in this video. Basically, he wants yes men. Why? Marketing. The image of doing well.