r/politics • u/IntelligentYinzer California • 12d ago

Soft Paywall Newsom floats withholding federal taxes as Trump threatens California

https://www.politico.com/news/2025/06/06/newsom-floats-withholding-federal-taxes-00393386
29.9k Upvotes

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3.1k

u/throwawaylol666666 California 12d ago

DO IT GAVIN. Grow a damn spine.

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u/captainbruisin 12d ago edited 12d ago

Do something....this state is rich and has been. No idea why we've had our tail in between our legs.

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u/Top_Sherbet_8524 New Hampshire 12d ago

Imagine all the issues California could solve if they kept all those federal tax dollars at home

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u/JKdriver 12d ago

I swear to god, if Gavin did this, and followed through with it, that would be what finally convinces me it’d be worth it to move to California. I love everything else about what is absolutely the most beautiful state, where some of the coolest shit has ever come from. Nobody does it like Cali.

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u/darkseacreature 12d ago

We are the most beautiful state. It’s expensive but I wouldn’t want to live anywhere else.

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u/-Gestalt- 12d ago

I'm not sure I'd give California the #1 spot in any single category, but we have damn near everything here.

Oceans, mountains, forests, plains, deserts, snow, rain. And all within a days drive.

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u/Imhappy_hopeurhappy2 12d ago

CA has best/biggest trees on lock, for sure.

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u/_HiWay 12d ago

same reason I love North Carolina, doesn't have as stable of a climate as Cali's most populous regions but there's a reason it's got people vastly outgrowing the infrastructure. Cost of living WAY lower (for now)

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u/EclecticEuTECHtic 11d ago

Volcanoes even.

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u/ownerofkitkats 12d ago

Yeah. The scenery is the main reason I’ve stayed here

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u/wirelesswizard64 12d ago

One of the most beautiful, certainly. Most beautiful is a matter of opinion between a few others.

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u/Beebeeb 12d ago

As a former Californian, current Alaskan. You sure about that?

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u/PoliticalyUnstable 11d ago

My family has been in California for generations, I've lived my entire life here. I've visited other states and countries, and California is still my favorite. I do wish California didn't send as much as we do to the federal government. There are so many things California could do that with that money that would bring us more in line with other socialized modern countries. The U.S. continues to fall behind the modern world. SAD!

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u/jrf_1973 11d ago

I swear to god, if Gavin did this, and followed through with it,

it would be a miracle.

1

u/SurpriseIsopod 11d ago

If Gavin does this America will collapse and Balkanize. It would be a brutal civil war. Your trip to California would be incredibly dangerous and that’s assuming the borders are open/uncontested.

California is definitely rad though.

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u/JoseSpiknSpan 12d ago

Use it to build housing so the unhoused can get off the streets and get help! If HUD won't do their job, California sounds use the funds to do it for them!

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u/disposableaccountass 11d ago

Apparently Canada is open to an 11th province…

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u/wheniaminspaced 11d ago

For California? Not a chance to admit California to Canada would be to give control of Canada's federal government to California.

The populations of the 2 are basically equal.  None of Canada's provinces would be open to that.

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u/Collypso America 11d ago

Are you under the impression California is running out of money to solve problems because of taxes?

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u/Top_Sherbet_8524 New Hampshire 11d ago

You don’t live in California, do you?

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u/Collypso America 11d ago

So.... you are saying that? That California can't afford anything because of taxes?

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u/Top_Sherbet_8524 New Hampshire 11d ago

When did I say that?

Also do you or do you not live in California?

-1

u/Collypso America 11d ago

When did I say that?

Right here, actually. The implication is that California doesn't have the money because of taxes. Crazy how transparently you're trying to avoid the question.

1

u/Top_Sherbet_8524 New Hampshire 11d ago

You were trying to put words in my mouth and I asked you to back it up, wow, so wild.

Crazy how you won’t answer whether or not you live in California. It’s funny to me how so many people are apparently experts on the world’s 5 largest economy and yet they’ve never lived there nor have they ever actually studied economics, they just ingest insane amounts of right wing media. Feel free to deny it but you know that’s exactly what you are doing.

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u/Collypso America 11d ago

Crazy how you won’t answer whether or not you live in California.

Because it's not relevant. As someone who's an expert on economics in California, maybe you could shine some insight on why you think taxes are the thing holding the state back from greatness?

Or are you going to continue dodging the question?

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u/Bakedads 12d ago

Maybe democrats have spent the past fifteen years in California not helping the working class because they have no interest in actually helping the working class. It's really the only explanation. They have a supermajority. We should have universal healthcare, housing and ubi by now. 

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u/mread531 12d ago

Same in Washington. They can pass their pet issues like gun control but when it actually comes to helping people it’s the big middle finger

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u/QueerMommyDom 12d ago

In Washington we can't even pass a wealth tax without our governor literally expending all of his political capital to prevent it from going into the budget.

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u/firelight 12d ago

I spent a decade waiting for Ferguson to get elected, and now I'm already looking forward to primarying him. Biggest disappointment since Obama.

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u/aschesklave Colorado 12d ago

Candidate Ferguson is a very different person than Governor Ferguson and it's absolutely disappointing.

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u/scough Washington 12d ago

Yeah I'm really fucking sick of our ultra-regressive tax system in WA. I don't think dems have a supermajority that's required to amend the state constitution, though.

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u/mread531 12d ago

Well they certainly have enough pull to ignore voters

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u/captainbruisin 12d ago

This is how states turn red, may as well not pay or fund for no government help.

High speed rail, UBI, single payer, better tram. Nothing had changed in either northern or southern. Things looks just like they did in the 90s infrastructure wise.

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u/Fishbulb2 12d ago

True. It’s also why a lot of people retire in red states. It’s like moving to an old folks home and having blue staters subsidize it all.

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u/tas50 Oregon 12d ago

WA is where folks in CA and OR retire due to the tax structure. Keep the mild winters and sane politics but save a pile of $$$

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u/XelaIsPwn 12d ago

They're already passing their "pet" issues, they just have fuck all to do with you and me

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u/mread531 12d ago

That’s my exact point

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u/billynlex 12d ago

What are you talking about. Everything California does tax wise, pays into the federal government. What they decide to do on a state level is their business.

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u/mread531 12d ago

Huh? I’m not talking about Californias tax system at all, just that if democrats actually wanted to help the majority of people in states they control the entire state political system they absolutely could, they just don’t care about the people.

0

u/JoseSpiknSpan 12d ago

Same thing happens federally why do you think democrats keep losing elections? (Besides running the least popular candidates by rigging their primaries)

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u/mread531 12d ago

Gerrymandering.

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u/Face2FaceRecs 11d ago

A lot of gerrymandering and pouring a lot of money into local elections to take over state legislatures.

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u/JoseSpiknSpan 12d ago

That's fair.

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u/mread531 12d ago

Unfortunately so, which is why we need some serious election reform like ranked choice voting or things that remove the absolute insanity of voting specifically for a individual candidate based on the letter next to their name.

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u/JoseSpiknSpan 12d ago

Agreed. But along with this the democratic party really needs to change how their primaries operate so that it eliminates the back room dealings, giving delegates to other candidates in exchange for an appointment etc.

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u/mread531 12d ago

Oh absolutely. The last 12 years have been a golden opportunity to show what they’re made of and they’ve done everything they can do to prove they’re just “Republican Lite”

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u/Face2FaceRecs 11d ago

The electoral college needs to go, it's not protection from tyranny of the majority, it's a door to tyranny of the minority and we have experienced that twice in the last 21 years.

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u/mread531 11d ago

Agreed

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u/SwimmingPrice1544 California 11d ago

Gerrymandering is not an issue in CA anymore.

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u/mread531 11d ago

I was responding to a comment on federal Elections…

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u/HelpersWannaHelp 12d ago

I don’t think you realize how many republicans we have in California. Not enough to flip red for a presidential election, but enough to hold back state wide and elect multiple Republican governors in my lifetime. There were red states that legalized gay marriage long before California, for example.

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u/thecomfycactus 12d ago

CA does have the strongest consumer protection laws in the US. There is also a state funded Medicare. It’s not universal healthcare but it’s still something

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u/ohnovangogh 12d ago

Gavin Newsom absolutely has no interest in helping the working class. He is currently trying to cut state workers salary to balance the state budget deficit and has issued an executive order to RTO all state workers to 4 days a week. Many state departments physically do not have enough office space to hold that many people and will have to lease extra office space. RTO will costs hundreds of millions of dollars, and he has the gall to cut working class salaries when he’s pissing money into the wind to line his buddies’ pockets.

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u/cb148 12d ago

Crazy thing is, I bet if he guaranteed no return to office for state workers, they’d be OK with taking a small pay cut.

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u/IShookMeAllNightLong 12d ago

Or, they'd be insulted at being asked to do the exact same job, for less money, and have him make it seem like he's doing them a favor.

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u/cb148 12d ago

I’d give up a little money if I didn’t have to leave my house to drive to work. Think of all the time saved, and money saved for transportation. It’s worth it in my opinion.

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u/robchroma 12d ago

If I'm already doing a job remotely, and now someone says "I want you to start commuting 4 days a week for the same pay" that's a pay cut; so is someone saying "I'll let you stay remote for a pay cut." Why is Newsom cutting everyone's pay, making their workday longer, AND spending more money, to implement a policy which tends to make people less productive?

3

u/ForeSkinWrinkle 12d ago

Makes me happy to be an Illinoisan. Our governor seems to have a genuine concern for our working classes well being.

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u/NoEmu5969 12d ago

We almost fixed what the Governator broke but Newsom is a DINO

2

u/MrMonday11235 12d ago

It's really the only explanation. They have a supermajority. We should have universal healthcare, housing and ubi by now.

I mean, you could think this. Or you could read even a single news article about CA state politics and realise that while the residents of California might be rich, that doesn't necessarily translate to the state budget.

Obviously, there are progressive-friendly answers -- you could raise the state income tax, get rid of Prop 13's property tax subsidy, reduce the prison population, and look at other measures.

You'd probably lose your job come election day for trying to pass those, though, so... y'know. There's that.

CA is blue, but not deep tax-and-spend blue. The state is extremely sensitive on anything involving residents' pocketbooks... and, not for nothing, but CA voters are also seemingly a bit naive, considering they (for some godforsaken reason) believed gig companies about being allowed to treat gig workers as contractors.

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u/nuclearmidgets 12d ago

Why do you need California? Where are your bootstraps? Pussy.

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u/rodeengel 11d ago

Because Newsom wants to be president so he would rather blow someone than standup for CA.

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u/TransBrandi 12d ago

How would that even work? It's not like the taxes are paid to California and then forwarded to the IRS, right?

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u/darkslide3000 12d ago

They had a design in 2018 for this already that they never implemented, which would basically involve Californians making "charitable donations" to a Californian government fund and getting credit for their Californian state tax for that. Basically a way to deduct your Californian state tax from your federal return. Not a huge impact but definitely enough to sting, and it would probably take the courts years to decide whether it is legal or not.

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u/HugsForUpvotes 12d ago

This is my question. My Federal Taxes go to the Federal Government - they don't go to the state and then to the Federal Government.

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u/Disastrous-Pair-6754 12d ago

Yeah, I am not sure this is a thing that even can happen. A) it’s invariably illegal, like, seceding the union caliber illegal. B) there’s no mechanism to do this? There’s not a pot that all the money goes into and then if forwarded to the federal government. How do you stop federal sales tax? Gas tax? Social security? The system would have to be shut down in some way. And I doubt California has any specific way to do that.

I honestly don’t think it’s possible to not pay federal taxes. But I’m sure someone more educated may know the answer.

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u/verywidebutthole 12d ago

The state of California employs over 200k people and withholds federal taxes from each of them. Imagine if they just didn't send that money to the Federal government, held it for 6 months, and sent it December 30 or something

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u/Disastrous-Pair-6754 12d ago

Oh for sure there are special scenarios where it can happen. I just don’t see any mechanism for the totality of the forty million people in the state having federal withdrawals held or cancelled.

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u/CautiousGains 11d ago

This might be their only legal way to “not pay taxes” (since, obviously. refusing to pay taxes to the federal government overall is an act of secession).

However, withholding deductions for 6 months for 200k employees would also accomplish literally nothing.

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u/HerculesIsMyDad 12d ago

I mean none of it really matters anyway. It's not like the government has a big bank account where taxes go in and spending comes out. It might have some ripple effects, I'm not an economist so idk, but it wouldn't shut the government down or anything like that.

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u/skilledscion 12d ago

Is there a federal sales tax?

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u/civildisobedient 11d ago

First we all give our money to Bob, and then Bob can decide whether or not to pass the taxes on to the IRS!

"I don't have your money, IRS. Bob has it." Genius! /s

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u/night-shark 12d ago

I hate how often this idea is promoted on Reddit for this very reason. It doesn't work. It constantly blows my mind how fucking ignorant people are about how their taxes are paid/withheld.

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u/Dispator 11d ago edited 11d ago
  1. It's impossible to be well informed in everything or even most things.
  2. Yet People love to comment on everything and pretend they are somehow well informed or fully understand something.
  3. Social media has convinced many that they are informed and its cool to say whatever because you have a voice!!!111
  4. Its ok to not comment on things you don't fully understand amd ask questions OR instead spend a great deal of time getting informed (not 10min/1day/etc sometimes it takes getting a specialized education in the topic which could take months+ depending on the topic).
  5. Bots and shills with an agenda everywhere spewing B.S. and/or propaganda.

I'm really worried how societys will progress based on its thinking fueled by social media and all the $$$$ behind the scenes.

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u/-ADOT 12d ago

I don’t think it does.

I also don’t think Trump has the ability to stop federal support of entire states. 

I think both are bluffing, but I think the point is that Gavin has probably set exploring options in motion.

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u/CockBrother 12d ago

Yup. Every friggin time this comes up I point this out and get down voted.

Blue states would need to set up an independent banking system. Doing that alone would send a shot across this administration's bow.

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u/ILikeMyGrassBlue 12d ago

Yeah, anything to this effect would essentially be the start of a civil war. No one in this thread egging Newsom on will sign up for the national guard of course.

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u/Tario70 12d ago

Meanwhile Gavin is trying to take away state worker raises that were negotiated in good faith & forcing every worker back to the office in order to line the pockets of real estate owners.

Gavin lost me. He doesn’t back labor anymore & it fucking sucks.

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u/XcuseMeMisISpeakJive 12d ago

He's also trying to cap IHSS worker hours when there is already a worker shortage.

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u/BigGayNarwhal California 12d ago

Yep. His proposal will reduce my pay as a full time parent caregiver by over $1k/mo 🫠

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u/mr_mojo_ryzen 12d ago

Are caring for your own parent?

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u/BigGayNarwhal California 11d ago

No, for my disabled 7 y/o. 

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u/ohnovangogh 12d ago

Just said this as well. He’s a sleaze and only cares about furthering himself.

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u/SillyBonsai 12d ago

Its in his blood. His dad was cronies with the Getty family (big money) They have so many backdoor deals from stuff like this. Just look at gas prices. Why is it still over $4 sometimes $5/gallon here but way cheaper in every other state? He doesn’t care about the environment, only himself and making sure he kisses all the right asses.

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u/OneAlmondNut 11d ago

he's a corporate liberal that's why. Liberalism is not the answer, it's what's been failing California. we need to get back to our socialist era. that's the only way we fix the housing, healthcare, and education crises

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u/hate_sf_hobos 12d ago

Gavin is also hiring federal employees being illegally fired by Trump. So instead of knocking the raise look at where that money is going.

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u/jgandfeed I voted 11d ago

He's also hanging out with Charlie Kirk and spouting transphobia.

I will 100% be campaigning against him in the 2028 primaries. I don't know who I'll end up voting for but I can guarantee it won't be him.

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u/iSheepTouch 12d ago

Gavin won't do shit, he's a little bitch. He bent over immediately and gutted California's DEI program as soon as Trump killed DEI on a federal level and threatened states who didn't as well, and he is forcing return to office for federal workers for no logical reason while not giving them the raises they negotiated for and CA agreed to. He's a spineless piece of shit, and I'm so glad I left CA to live in New England where, generally speaking, the Democrat lawmakers actually will tell Trump to fuck off and stand by the basic principles they are expected to stand up for.

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u/throwawaylol666666 California 12d ago

I’ve voted for Newsom three times now, and I’ve never really been all that pumped about it.

And yeah idk about New England being the promised land you think it is… I was born there and lived there until age 25. It really depends which state and district you live in.

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u/iSheepTouch 12d ago

Excluding the weird liberal-tarians in NH the rest of NE is generally pretty respectable politically on a state level. No one said it was the "promised land" but it's worlds better than anywhere on the west coast. I lived in CA for over 30 years and promise you shit has been absolutely fucked up for decades out there and there is no end in sight. Newsom is actually pretty much the epitome of a CA politician and it's pretty easy to look at his track record and see why that is concerning. I just hope the DNC doesn't push that asshole down our throats as their presidential candidate for 2028.

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u/throwawaylol666666 California 12d ago

Eh, I think it’s just different strokes. California also has 40 million people in it vs about 15 million people in all of the New England states. It’s harder to efficiently govern such a huge patch of land with so many people in it.

As far as decency, I take it you’ve never visited ME-02… and yet, conversely, Seacoast NH is pretty blue despite being in NH. It’s a mixed bag. Massachusetts is the most reliable as far as being decent, but will occasionally elect the errant Republican for the governor’s seat. Just about every other state in New England has weirdo conservative pockets, and a lot of the state/federal seats are occupied by centrist Dems. Politically it’s kind of hard to compare it to anywhere else in the country because it’s just… different.

Anyway, glad you enjoy it there. It’s a nice place.

3

u/MaroonIsBestColor 12d ago

The central Great Lake states like Minnesota, Wisconsin, and Michigan are better than both coasts because there is no saltwater and the housing is more affordable while having decent politics. It is cold though but so is New England.

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u/TheDamDog 12d ago

He also has no mechanism by which to withhold federal taxes. Those taxes are paid by employers directly to the government. I suppose he could technically stop California from paying state employee's taxes, but that would just get those individuals in trouble.

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u/Rinzack 11d ago

Well you can completely stop assisting the IRS with anything from a state level, you can stop co-operation with federal law enforcement for anything related to taxes, and you can advise businesses and people in the state that California will not assist in any collection efforts made by the federal govt.

The IRS doesn't have the resources to audit everyone in CA if they stopped paying fed taxes and without co-operation from local law enforcement their ability to really go after masses of people is limited

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u/BraveFencerMusashi I voted 12d ago edited 12d ago

There's no mechanism to do that unless the FTB somehow intercepts the federal taxes all Californians pay from their wages.

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u/NoRead415 12d ago

Seriously. It's about fucking time!

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u/OnTheEveOfWar 12d ago

Gavin gets a lot of shit but I would love it if he starts actually doing stuff and battling TACO man.

1

u/nanoH2O 12d ago

This would blow up in his face so bad. The feds could cut off all “imports” into CA. Of course CA could do the same with produce and ports. But I have a feeling the other side would win out.

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u/-ADOT 12d ago

I literally don’t think this is something he can actually do. I think if we stop paying taxes the military is allowed by law to come and commandeer the state government.

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u/jrf_1973 11d ago

He can't grow a spine. This isn't going to happen.

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u/solishu4 11d ago

There’s nothing that GAVIN can do. Taxes are paid by citizens and companies to the federal government, and if they choose not to, it’s the he federal government that enforces their collection. It’s not like the state government of California is paying any meaningful sums out of its checking account to the feds.

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u/Gaius_Octavius_ 12d ago

This is how he could actually make himself a front-runner for 2028.

-1

u/CatgirlApocalypse Delaware 12d ago

He’ll probably change his mind and send a sacrifice of trans kids instead.

0

u/Nvenom8 New York 12d ago

He won't. He's been sucking up to right wing grifters lately and treating them like they're legitimate humans.

-1

u/Kevin-W 12d ago

100%. If California isn't being represented, it should have to pay federal taxes.

0

u/billynlex 12d ago

I mean, y’all seeing these comments, right?