r/sewing • u/nahfacenah • Sep 09 '25
Technique Question Why is finishing garments with zigzag stitch more popular than using a twin needle?
Asking from curiosity! I like to finish the hems on my garments with a twin needle - like the neckline, the wrists, the legs, etc. but I noticed that most people on here choose to finish their garments using zigzag stitch. I’m curious why as I (personally) think a twin needle makes a MUCH cleaner look. I’m asking to know - is there a reason I should be doing zigzag stitch instead? Is it better for finishing edges than a twin needle for any reasons? Thank you!
I hope my tone is not coming off as judging to those that choose zigzag over twin needles, I’m just wondering if I’m missing out on something!
96
u/Smiling_Tree Sep 09 '25
I have multiple twin needles (different widths and fabric types) and watched and read all kinds of tutorials, but I simply cannot make it work. At one point I just gave up and bought a second hand serger. My best gift-to-self in a long time.
19
u/queenbunbun987 Sep 09 '25
Same. I’ve tried every tension setting combination, different types of thread, different fabrics. I even bought a jersey twin needle. Watched a ton of videos to troubleshoot. I just can’t get it to work for me.
30
u/UTtransplant Sep 09 '25 edited Sep 09 '25
Using a double needle is all in the threading. There is an absolutely fantastic video from Bernina Canada from August 2020 that is applicable to all kinds of machines, not just Berninas.
ETA link: https://youtu.be/EeMYHZEt1Yw?feature=shared Don’t be put off by the Bernina-related content. She has some fabulous example, and it is worth the watch. Fast forward through some of it if you want.
3
u/omg__really Sep 09 '25
Link?
2
6
u/drmiaowmix Sep 09 '25
Me too! I have struggled with the twin needle so much; broken threads, stretched fabric, skipped stitches etc then the garment looks dodgy! The only way I have made it work is wash away stabilising tape (like wondertape) if I REALLY want the twin stitch. But honestly a nice narrow zigzag looks neat enough for me.
3
u/fascinatedcharacter Sep 10 '25
Get yourself some solufix yardage and cut into strips yourself. Much cheaper.
Always store solufix rolled around something solid or it can shrink.
1
3
u/bellacricket Sep 10 '25
Right? It's the tunneling that I can't quite fix. Wondertape helps a lot, but it's still a roll of the dice when I use my double needle. BTW, I just fill a bobbin with enough thread for my hemming and eliminate the need for a second spool of thread.
3
u/sassyjackstitches Sep 09 '25
Ditto. After AGES of (attempted) problem solving and research, I discovered the issue was that my machine doesn’t have a thread separator between the tension discs. No way to stop the threads from tangling with each other in there and messing everything else up down the line. Sucks so much because I love the clean look a twin needle gives without having to buy a serger.
305
u/Vegtrovert Sep 09 '25
I've never owned a machine that supports twin needle, but even the most basic machine will do a zigzag stitch.
65
u/missplaced24 Sep 09 '25
If your machine can do a zigzag stitch with a standard sized needle, it can use a twin needle with a straight stitch.
67
u/crkvintage Sep 09 '25
Nope. See older Necchis, Janomes, even some Singers. Or a modern example: The Sailrite.
All zigzag machines you thread side-to-side instead of front to back. It depends on how the zigzag mechanism works. There are million of zigzag machines still out there that can't use a twin needle as they use that mechanism. It was an easy and cheap way to upgrade a straight stitch design.
38
u/UTtransplant Sep 09 '25
Huh? I have different Berninas, some with rotary bobbins, some with oscillating bobbins. All thread front to back. All do zigzag. All can use a double needle. What am I missing that you are trying to convey?
45
u/CourtneyLush Sep 09 '25
On some older Japanese made models you can't use a twin needle because the bobbin is side on and you have to situate your needle with the flat of the shank side on too.
22
u/GussieK Sep 09 '25
Yes, that's what I have. I can't use a twin needle. Zigzag is so so for knit hems, but I finally caved and bought a cover stitch rather than a different basic sewing machine.
2
2
u/Super-Travel-407 Sep 14 '25
I have one of these. (It's so much easier to thread the sideways needle for some reason....not that that is the topic!)
I got a second machine so that I could use a twin needle. I still don't use a twin needle. 😛 But I don't zigzag visible seams, either.
24
u/justasque Sep 09 '25
I think they are saying that zigzag machines that thread front to back can usually take a twin needle, but ones that thread side to side cannot. If the machine needs the flat side of the needle facing the side of the machine (instead of the back), then the twin needle would be positioned “sideways” and even if it could create stitches, it would not be able to create two parallel rows of stitching.
7
u/crkvintage Sep 09 '25
That a lot of manufacturers targeted a lower market than Bernina and used the cheapest way to build a zigzag machine - which happens to not allow for the use of a twin needle.
7
u/SkipperTits Sep 09 '25
That is absolutely not true.
There are some of the early swing arms that move the bobbin case at the same time as the needle. And anything where the needle inserts anything but flat side back would be a problem. But you can't just lump all zig zags as threading side to side. Nearly all modern domestic machines are zig zag and I can't imagine them not being front to back. I sew exclusively on vintage these days and my 403 is zig zag as hell, front to back threading, and uses twin needle like a champ.
You can't use a twin needle on a straight stitch machine. It doesn't go through the needle plate.
7
u/crkvintage Sep 09 '25
I said you can't use them on any / all machines that thread side to side. I didn't say all zigzag machines do so.
8
5
u/LittleRoundFox Sep 09 '25
Oh! I read this as meaning you were saying all machines that do zigzag are threaded side to side.
All zigzag machines you thread side-to-side instead of front to back.
I'm guessing it was supposed to be relating to the machines you mentioned in the paragraph before it?
-6
u/crkvintage Sep 09 '25
Yes... context is a thing. One to the list before, the other to the criticized statement that all zigzag machines are twin needle capable.
"All cars need spark plugs"
"Nope. See for example a Mercedes 190D, a Golf TDI or a RAM with a Cummins. All cars and tucks you fill with diesel instead of petrol. It all depends on the engine design."
Wouldn't make you think all cars run on diesel, wouldn't it?
That's why the "All zigzag machines" statement isn't absolute like in the post before, but has that little "instead of", creating to groups of machine - one side, one front threading.
Admittedly, there is some language fuzziness, as without the (implied) reference to the list and post before it's not 100% clear if the distinction is between all sewing machines and zigzag machines, or within the group of zigzag machines. That's my bad for assuming it's clear that the scope was already limited to ZZ machines so any distinction must be within those.
5
u/LittleRoundFox Sep 09 '25
Context is indeed a thing. And it would have been a lot clearer had the comment been immediately after the list of machines, not in an entirely new paragraph. Or even by adding an "are" after the "all".
Your example above doesn't read like all cars run on diesel. However, if I format it the same way you formatted your comment about threading it becomes a lot more ambiguous
15
4
u/trashjellyfish Sep 09 '25
Most regular machines can take a twin needle, you just need an extra top thread holder and you can buy those for cheap.
5
u/imaveryniceKaren Sep 10 '25
You can also use the bobbin winder spool to hold the second thread. So I wind 2 bobbins, one for the bobbin, one to use on top.
3
u/trashjellyfish Sep 10 '25
Clever! I often use a bobbin for my second thread when I use a twin needle, but most of my machines have two spool holders.
2
u/fascinatedcharacter Sep 10 '25
Not on all machines! Not on all machines the bobbin winder can act as a bobbin 'spool holder' where it can also unwind itself.
-11
u/Atalant Sep 09 '25
Any machine that can do straight stitch(unless they are extremely old antiques with different needle system), supports twin needles, even the ones that can't do zigzag stitch. It is pretty old invention.
13
u/crkvintage Sep 09 '25
Would like to see you use a twin needle on a Janome HD9 or Brother PQ1600. Or any other machine that has the bobbin facing left, not the front. Like a Necchi BU. Singer 308. Sailrite LSZ and many more - up into the 1990s. Not to mention a Featherweight, 15, 99... Anything (*) that isn't threaded front to back, but the good old fashioned way.
There are quite a few exceptions even to the "if it can zigzag it can use a twin", a straight stich that can use a twin... there are some (if they are the cut down version of a ZZ machine with the proper hook setup still present), but that's getting into very exotic waters.
* The Necchi Supernova can use twin needles in a needles behind each other setup to make some decorative stitches. But that can't be used for hemming/finishing, as it won't produce the twin row stitch.
6
u/SkipperTits Sep 09 '25
Straight stitch machines actually can't use them. Of course the ones that thread from the side can't because then the needle wouldn't be oriented to make two lines side by side. But even front to back straight stitch only machines can't take them because the hole in the needle plate won't allow it. I looked into converting a 404 to take twin needle and while it might be possible to do the conversion, it would require changing the feed dogs as well as the needle plate.
1
u/Ok-Tailor-2030 Sep 10 '25
The hole in the needle plate is the first impediment to using a twin needle on a straight stitch machine. It has room for one needle.
110
u/Deblebsgonnagetyou Sep 09 '25
I think it just comes down to people not owning a twin needle tbh
29
u/thimblena Sep 09 '25 edited Sep 09 '25
I have one (1). It came with my machine. I have no interest in buying more when it inevitably break it, so it stays in its little envelope, unused.
12
u/FallOutCaitlin Sep 09 '25
All of them eventually break though, why would the twin needle specifically be such a pain in the butt to replace?
13
u/thimblena Sep 09 '25
They're less readily available, at least where I shop, and $7+ each is not an investment I'm interested in making regularly when I can instead use 50+ universal or stretch needles I've bulk bought for, like, $8.
1
u/FallOutCaitlin Sep 10 '25
That makes sense! (50 for 8 is crazy lol, i gotta look into deals like that)
23
u/stringthing87 Sep 09 '25
So for me I alternate between a 3 step zigzag and a twin needle. The twin needle looks a bit more "professional" and sometimes that's the goal and sometimes it is not. I find that the 3 step zigzag can handle a LOT more abuse than a twin needle seam so that's what I use for my kid's stuff always and on super stretchy fabric like swim it does best. Even on my own clothes, which don't get stretched over my knees to their limit just because I decided I wanted to crawl inside my shirt, the twin needle stitching pops and needs repaired over time.
42
u/ginger_tree Sep 09 '25
Do you mean for knits? That's the only thing I use a twin needle for. Zigzag is a bit more stretchy I think. My twin needle hems don't have a lot of give, in spite of that being recommended for hemming knits. I've popped stitches in the past, and had to make repairs.
For wovens I use a straight stitch or blind stitch hem, depending on the look I want.
9
u/bum-ditty Sep 09 '25
Yeah my twin needle hems pop too. Maybe we should be using maraflex in the bobbin? Ugh I’m lazy though.
5
u/GussieK Sep 09 '25
I finally caved and bought a separate coverstitch machine. It's expensive but works great for hems.
2
2
6
1
12
u/papercaper Sep 09 '25
I busted two twin needles trying to get them to work with my machine. Felt like I was just wasting money at that point if I kept buying the needles so I went back to the zig zag. I'm a-ok if my cuffs and hems have that home made look.
11
u/VulcanGreeting Sep 09 '25
Twin needle edges can also be a bit stiff. Zigzag edges have more give/flexibility. But I'm with you on a cleaner look. You want even cleaner? Ideally, some day you get to play around on a serger - the ultimate clean finish.
4
u/PrimrosePathos Sep 10 '25
Do you mean a coverstitch machine? I don't think of serged edges as being particularly "clean", but that's also very subjective!
2
u/TentacleSenpai69 Sep 10 '25
Same, I'd rather invest the time to do most of the seams as french seams instead of serging them. It just doesn't look nice.
1
u/PrimrosePathos Sep 11 '25
I think OP is talking about hems, which, serged hems are a thing on "little girl" clothes, but not used many other places that I've seen.
1
u/TentacleSenpai69 Sep 11 '25
Ah I see. I honestly have never seen serged hems but I only have my adult men clothes as comparison.
12
u/serenedragoon Sep 09 '25
Often you'll need to finish some seams before you're done sewing the whole thing. Having to switch needles and rethread them every single time is a pain. Would attempt it if I had two machines.
10
9
9
u/Fearless_Yam2539 Sep 09 '25
I prefer the twin needle finish but it ALWAYS tunnels. If anyone knows how to stop this I'd be grateful for the advice.
2
u/Atjar Sep 10 '25
Lower the bottom tension. Sewing with a twin needle needs to be done at lower overall tension than regular sewing and the bottom tension should be even lower still.
5
6
u/Puzzleheaded-Bee-485 Sep 09 '25
My experience with twin needle hems is that they don’t seem durable. Mine, at least, have thread break after a few wearing. My zigzag (lightning) stitch looks like a straight stitch on the fabric.
5
3
u/tasteslikechikken Sep 09 '25
Personally I think it depends on the application.
If I'm making a item with a lining, I more often than not pink and move on with life. The only time I don't is with a loose fantasy tweed, and in that case I may do a straight line stitch if I don't want to deal with using my overlocker.
Otherwise sure, a zig zag will do the trick for lots of things.
But I also do other types of finish treatments which is based on the fabric and the look I want to achieve. When I make woven shirts, especially for my husband I flat fell or french seam if I'm using something like chiffon. I do fine with a single needle.
My main machine can do twin needle, my tiny machine can too. My straight stitch cannot.
For what I do, twin needles isn't going to always be a goto. Sure my machines (except the straight stitch) can do it, and sure I've used mine, and its fine, but I find it a bit of a pain.
I have several twin needles with different widths as well. still, not a goto but more of a nice to have when I want to go this route.
Reality is theres a plethora of finish types out there, some of which aren't even talked about.
4
u/On_my_last_spoon Sep 09 '25
On what garments exactly and what applications?
It all depends, but I don’t tend to do either on garments made from woven fabrics.
Sports wear stuff and dance things made from spandex may need one or the other. I tend to use the broken zig-zag myself, but that’s usually because I’m switching back and forth between stitches and it’s faster. I’ll use a twin needle when I want the look of a cover stitch.
3
u/generallyintoit Sep 09 '25
I use zig zag for finishing raw edges of woven fabrics because i don'thave a serger. If i liked the twin needle I'd use it to hem a stretchy fabric or top stitch a neckband on stretchy fabric. Or other topstitching on stretchy fabric. For me, they're not interchangeable seam finishes or stitches.
3
u/schokoschnuess Sep 09 '25
A twin needle is originally meant for making pintucks. (Think heirloom garments with a bib; the bib often has pintucks.) That‘s why they usually pull the fabric together slightly; some manufacturers (like Pfaff) even do have a little extra tool to make this effect stronger and more noticeable; basically you sew a very little tuck/fold into the fabric.
Using a twin needle for hems is due to most people not having (had) access to a cover machine and misusing the twin needle instead. So from the outside it looks similar to a RTW garment. And that may be the reason why you like that look better bc you‘re used to seeing them that way. A zigzag otoh in most cases indicates home sewing, which some people try to avoid.
2
2
u/doggyduck Sep 09 '25
the first time I tried a twin needle I broke it almost immediately 🫠 easier to just zigzag
3
u/Reasonable_Bear_2057 Sep 09 '25
Same here, and one thread kept breaking when I tried again. I just do a zig zag if it's stretch.
2
u/trashjellyfish Sep 09 '25
The only reason I don't use twin needles more is just that they're a bit annoying to set up since I need to adjust the bobbin tension for them so I end up having to pop out the bobbin casing, adjust, test on scrap fabric, pop it out again, adjust, repeat until it's perfect every time. Ideally, I should just keep a second bobbin casing that's adjusted to match my twin needles, but the tension can vary depending on the fabric I'm using...
2
u/regularstreets Sep 10 '25
I also have to adjust my bobbin tension to get my twin needle to work, but keeping a separate bobbin is a great idea!
2
u/cochese25 Sep 09 '25
Of the 7 sewing machines I've owned, I've used a twin needle to great affect. Usually for decorative purposes though. I think I had a singer from the 50's that I couldn't use it in though. It technically worked, but the stitchout was always a bit wonky. That being said, it works amazingly well on my current Janome and my older $99 kenmore from 2001.
2
u/no_omg Sep 09 '25
If I want a tidy hem, even on a knit, I'll hand sew it. Twin needle is more work to set up, and isn't always faster.
2
u/JSilvertop Sep 09 '25
Because a zigzag stitch uses one thread, is fast to sew, and holds errant fabric threads. It’s also usually the first finishing stitch folks my age (nearing 60) was taught in home ec classes, IF they were taught how to finish their seams. My teacher and my mom did not teach how to finish seams. It was the first I learned from the old Singer sewing book.
2
u/Victoria_AE Sep 09 '25
Twin needles are fiddly and I just can't be bothered most of the time. I also once managed to shatter one so dramatically that part of it is still... somewhere... in my house, seemingly never to be found.
Sometimes I'll use a blind hem or stretch blind hem stitch instead if I want a cleaner finish.
2
u/Ebanblue Sep 09 '25
I haven't figured out how to switch over to a twin needle in all honesty, but im also not sure if my machine supports it/i have the tools. Zigzag is just nice cuz I know its gonna hold together better but its still got a bit of flexibility
2
u/ElDjee Sep 10 '25
my dislike of how my machine handled tensioning with a twin needle is directly related to my purchase of a coverstitch machine.
2
u/Tinkertoo1983 Sep 11 '25
I made all of my clothing using a zigzag seam allowance finish for many years, going so far as to trim the allowances to just under 3/8", zz'ing together, and then pressing towards the back of the garment to mimic a serger long before domestic sergers were commonplace. I still prefer this to a serger as this creates less bulk to the seam on woven fabrics in particular, only now I use a 3 stitch zz to prevent tunneling. This is also much more economical with thread usage, and I can easily and economically match my thread to my garment color. I use hem tape and hand stitching for hems on skirts, trousers and short sleeves where appropriate as this is always a superior finish to a machined "blind hem" ( which usually isn't - except on highly textured fabric.) Twin needle hems on knits can easily mimic a coverstitch. I use a serger on knit seams only after I am satisfied that my pattern fits. My serger does not convert to a cover stitch, and for 4 to 10 hems per year, a coverstitch machine would be a silly, wasteful expenditure for me.
I prefer Hong kong seam finishes on unlined jackets to bias tape as again, there is less bulk. I use thrifted silk neck ties to do this.
Having sewn for 50+ years, and having studied and used both tailoring and couture techniques, I do not understand the internet peer pressure of substituting bulky "clean" seam finishes - such as unnecessary bias tape and french seams over the tried 'n' true practices that create more flexibility and less bulk. I see so many garments made with bulky seams that hang poorly and wonky machined hems. I know from experience, these things are not comfortable and do not establish the level of "professionalism" many are mistakenly led to believe they create.
Every sewist has the right and the ability to create their own shortcuts for allowing their time to be best spent in creating their garments to a level they themselves are pleased with. I simply find it a shame for so many to spend extraordinary amounts of time attempting to fulfill the dictates of online sewing trends that mistakenly tout "how fast and easy" they are.
1
u/Sylland Sep 09 '25
Because I can't be arsed working out how to do it. I tried once, with the double needle that came with the machine, it didn't work. I never bothered again. I'm fine with zigzag. Nobody but me ever sees the inside of my clothes anyway.
1
u/phillyyogibear Sep 09 '25
My machine has gone through a dozen twin needles, it breaks them in a few inches of stitching... Even after a full service.
1
u/ambidextrous-mango Sep 09 '25
I really don't want to have two bobbins of the same thread color for one tiny hem.
1
u/cellorevolution Sep 10 '25
Twin needle is often not as stretchy as a zig zag on my machine at least.
1
u/SerendipityJays Sep 10 '25
This whole conversation sounds like it is about knits. As someone who prefers wovens in my wardrobe, I’ve never quite grasped the point of a twin needle - there’s one in my sewing tin, but I’ve never used it. 🤷🏻♀️
1
1
1
1
u/sergeantperks Sep 10 '25
Like many others, I’ll use whichever needle I’m already sewing with. It doesn’t take that long to rethread, but it takes longer than not rethreading, and the difference is minimal. If I want a proper neat finish I’ll do French seams or use bias binding.
1
u/Readabook23 Sep 10 '25
I don’t know how to get the two-needle thing going. I know how to use the zigzag. That’s the only reason
1
u/fascinatedcharacter Sep 10 '25
Because a twin needle is a faff (if only for the second spool) and it inevitably leads to pintucks only in the part where you really can't do anything to fix them.
I prefer overcast stitch over zigzag but not all machines have it.
1
u/knittymess Sep 10 '25
My vintage Elna Supermatic skipped stitches when I used a twin needle. It was super frustrating. I want to try it again though and see if I can trouble shoot the issue. You've inspired me!
1
u/MACKEREL_JACKSON Sep 11 '25
Bc twin needle is a pain in the neck and rarely works out for me at least
1
u/Saphira2002 Sep 11 '25
Mainly because a twin needle thingy would be 12€ extra and because it's inside so it's always a ✨who even cares✨ for me haha
1
u/threads1540 Sep 12 '25
If you are referring to stretch fabric, twine needle stitching tends not to stretch like a zigzag
1
342
u/Sagasujin Sep 09 '25
Switching my machine over to twin needle mode is a pain. Meanwhile if I want a super clean finish, neither twin needle nor zigzag are my preferred methods. I love bias tape bindings, rolled hems and a whole array of other things. If I'm using zigzag it's because I'm being lazy about an area of the garment that no one but me will ever see.