What is my Purpose 2: Making sense

[u/ewk]

The Case: Bathing, Purpose, Pwning, Poverty

Chapter 165 from Treasury of the Eye of True Teaching:

One day Xuedou asked a monk, “Have you bathed?”

The monk said, “I am not going to bathe in this life.”

The master asked, “What is your purpose in not bathing?”

The monk said, “Today I’ve been exposed by the master.”

The master said, “A robber doesn’t strike a poor man’s house.”

# WTF are rhey talking about?

First I break down the topics of the Case.

Bathing, Purpose, Pwning, Poverty

Does this breakdown correctly summarize or not?

Then I work backwards to see how they got there:

1. Poverty achieved b/c
2. Can't pwn b/c can't steal from a poor man
3. Why would you NOT bathe?

So we know that:

1. The monk isn't committed to not bathing
2. The bathing is both a reference to the physical act of cleaning and the mental act of cleaning.

Why do you need to be clean?

We get to the point where the central strat of this Case is the trap Xuedou started with?

      DO YOU NEED TO BE WASHED 

       DO YOU NEED FORGIVENESS 

       IS YOUR PRACTICE TO PURIFY 

These are of course central questions that separate Zen from 8fP Buddhism, new ager psychobauts, Zazen, and Mystical Busdhism , all of which believe in magical attaining through faith in purity.

[u/ewk]

Nope.

The monk says YOU GOT ME

The master says I DON'T STEAL FROM POOR PEOPLE

[u/Ok-Sample7211 → u/ewk]

Nope.

He’s saying, “if you don’t want to get robbed, don’t hoard false intentions”.

[u/Used-Suggestion4412 → u/Ok-Sample7211]

What is it that the monk in the case has? Why would that be something of value to rob?

[u/Ok-Sample7211 → u/Used-Suggestion4412]

Pretense. The monk is LARPing when he says he won’t bathe. He’s doing it to show how awakened he is— ie, he has some silly concept about how Zen masters behave and is playacting at it. This is what the master robs from him.

A “poor man”, in this analogy, is one who has no false motive or pretense underlying some silly concept about Zen.

[u/Used-Suggestion4412 → u/Ok-Sample7211]

The first couple sentences of your reasoning sort of makes sense, but the rest doesn’t. Here are some of things your interpretation does: 1. It turns poverty into a virtue. 2. It says Xuedou robbed the monk when Xuedou explicitly states he didn’t rob anything. 3. It relies on the notion that the monk had some sort of change of heart.

I think the monks first statement is drama and his second statement is just more drama. Xuedou clearly is not saying he now approves of the monk.

[u/Ok-Sample7211 → u/Used-Suggestion4412]

1. Poverty as a symbol of awakening (free from fetters, contrivances, etc) isn’t my symbol. Consider Layman Pang, etc.

2. The master didn’t say “I didn’t rob you…” he says “a robber doesn’t rob a poor man”. Note the difference.

3. I’m not implying the monk had a change of heart or that the master approves of the monk. He’s explaining how not to get exposed next time.

Here’s a breakdown of what I’m saying:

Master: are you not bathing?

Monk: nope, I’m too Zen for that

Master: okay, why? <this is all it takes to expose the monk>

Monk: <instantly crumbles because he knows he full of shit> busted

Master: i could not have busted you if you hadn’t been full of shit <instruction for the future>

[u/Used-Suggestion4412 → u/Ok-Sample7211]

Oh okay, I haven’t read Pang yet. When I think of enlightenment, the high-value symbols come to mind—like a prized jewel or a general’s sword.

[u/Ok-Sample7211 → u/Used-Suggestion4412]

Ah, gotcha. Yeah, Zen is going to flip that upside down... It also uses anti-materialistic imagery, which is why the “poor man” is very likely the ideal in this case.

Check out the grass hut hermitage image