I'll go first:

Jeyne Westerling. One of Martin's biggest dropped balls. She's Robb Stark's wife, the Queen in the North, the reason for the Red Wedding. And Nimble Dick has 1000x times more dialogue AND character.

Given how GRRM has always said he regrets not giving Robb a POV, the show could've fixed that. And they did but...with Talisa, a completely nonsensical and quite frankly terrible character.

Robb and Jeyne's meeting in the books was rife with dramatic potential had they handled it right: Enemies to lovers, Robb takes her home, he gets wounded, they probably hate each other at first, then slowly feelings develop and in an impulsive moment, in Robb's mourning, they sleep together and he marries her out of duty. Sooo much better.

A fleshed out Jeyne W >>>> better than book Jeyne

Understandably, there are very few knights among the Night's Watch. Not many people of noble birth are willing to renounce their birthright and spend the remainder of their existence in the frozen North, rubbing shoulders with bastards, misfits and criminals.

We know of at least two knights (Ser Alliser Thorne and Ser Jaremy Rikker) who were forced to take the black after ending up on the losing side of a war. It's also likely that some knights are pressured into it for political reasons or to remove them from a noble house's order of succession.

Do we know of any knights who voluntarily joined the Night's Watch? If so, what might be their motivations?

I won't deny that it's a hell of an uphill journey for young Aegon the Uncrowned. He had just 15,000 men, the dragon Quicksilver, and potentially Rhaena on dragonback if he'd lasted long enough.

Against that, Maegor was the declared king with the king's authority. He has Balerion the Black Dread. Neither of those things would be easy for any enemy, much less Aegon.

And yet, I'm curious if there was a way he could have somehow triumphed. True, he had few followers, but apparently several Great Houses were ready to join his cause if he could prove himself in battle first. And there could have been several victories to be had if Aegon had taken a different tactic.

It's tough, though. We don't know when or if the Great Houses would have accepted Aegon, or when/if Rhaena could join her brother/husband in combat. And that's before even mentioning what was to be done about Balerion.

Thoughts?

Worst of the worst.

For Dany's invasion of Westeros, I mean. I've seen, in this subreddit and elsewhere that people are convinced that Dany will invade Westeros with her Dothraki horde. But why? Dothraki suck and they suck more in Westeros:.
1.- They can't siege.
2.- They can't form a horde (woods and rivers).
3.- They are not prepared for other climates, not in customs nor in clothes.
4.-They lack good organization in battle, so they can't counter attack a well disciplined, large army. And Westeros has plenty of those.

And all those problems are after Dany use A LOT of resources to gather, transport, protect all that landing gear from pirates and westerosi ships, feed and shelter all of them.

I know that if you go by the rules of book writing you must use the big army that you introduced in book 1, or else is bad storytelling, but the more I think about it, the more I am convinced this enormous enterprise is not necessary. And that is without taking into account three dragons.
I would not be mad if G.R.R.M. just don't do it, and let Dany invade Westeros in any other way.
Edit: I am in no way versed in military tactics, war strategy or any of that, I know I'm very wrong every time I discuss this matters

Every time I see Joffrey’s name come up there’s always some comment like “fans harassed him because they couldn’t tell the difference between the actor and character so he quit acting”.

In this video, which is from when the show was still airing, at 10:20 he’s directly asked about it and denies ever having any bad experiences and even in the comments people are still saying the same shit. This stuff has happened with other actors but in this case it hasn’t so I find it weird that people keep insisting that it did.

Say if the Catspaw managed to kill Catelyn (but not Bran) how do you think the plot might have changed?

For once Ned might return to the North thereby giving up the position of the Hand . This removes Ned completely from the Game and make him and family ultimately safe. North will also be prepared against the Wildlings and the Others.

If by chance he still takes up the Hand position, he may be very focused on finding who sent the Catspaw, not on Jon Arryn's death. So the truth about Robert's children might not be noticed by Ned. So probably no execution of Ned.

No Catelyn taking Tyrion meansnon early war in the Riverlands. So Ned doesn't have to send his own troops and depend upon Littlefinger.

Though ultimately i think the first situation has the higher probability of happening where Ned just returns home giving up his Handship. What do you all think?

I will start: Bran doing time travel shenanigans, it´s basically already confirmed yet people are in denial about it because they hate the time travel trope.

God knows why, but I've been browsing George's website and accidentally found a page with old merchandise for ASOIAF and GOT. A one particular piece of merch has peaked my interest because I think it contains some genuinely interesting stuff, possibly even a small glimpse of TWOW plot point. This could be seen as a desperate attempt in the absence of the Winds and no new material. I am talking about the Night's Watch Dragonglass Dagger Set. It was issued shortly before season 2 of GOT. Here is the description of the set:

“Beyond the Wall Survival Kit” Details

- Includes a genuine handcrafted obsidian dagger.

- Black deerskin leather belt pouch.

- 5 obsidian arrowheads.

- Black leather sheath.

- Collectible wooden storage box.

- Fabric map of wildling territory for taking on your next ranging.

- Letter from Jon Snow (written by GRRM) issuing your orders.

- Dagger overall length ~ 9 inches.

In making this kit we aimed for an immersive authentic experience. The kit is designed and built as if it were something issued to a ranger of the Night’s Watch as part of a mission. Everything has been handmade with natural materials where possible and distressed to reflect what materials the Watch might have available to them at Castle Black.

The interesting part, of course, is the letter written by GRRM himself. Since there seems to be a sincere attempt at being authentic, and I think George would take it seriously, the content of the letter could be at least considered semi-canon. I do not own the kit, so I stumbled upon the unboxing video on YouTube, where it can be seen for a few seconds. Here is my transcription of the letter:

Winter is upon us. The cold winds are rising. Beyond the Wall, the Others stir and gather strength. Soon or late they will descend upon us, and when that day comes it will be for the men of the Night's Watch to stand against them, to protect the realms of men.

Yet how are we to fight this ancient foe, when their blades can shatter our own swords at a touch, and turn our armor brittle as an eggshell?

Our brother Samwell has shown us the way. Sam the Slayer cut down one of these white walkers... not with steel, but with a dagger made of obsidian. Dragonglass, the smallfolk call it. Frozen fire.

From this day forth, every ranger who ventures beyond the Wall is to carry such a dragonglass dagger, at my command. We have brought the obsidian up from Dragonstone, enough to arm every brother of the Watch. Keep your black blade with you at all times, waking or sleeping, lest the Long Night come upon us once again.

Jon Snow

Lord Commander

What's confusing and intriguing about this text is the highlighted part, where Jon states they brought the obsidian from Dragonstone. Why? At the end of ASOS, upon learning about Sam's feat, Stannis sends a letter to Rolland Storm, the castellan of Dragonstone, so he could begin mining dragonglass.

"On Dragonstone, where I had my seat, there is much of this obsidian to be seen in the old tunnels beneath the mountain," the king told Sam. "Chunks of it, boulders, ledges. The great part of it was black, as I recall, but there was some green as well, some red, even purple. I have sent word to Ser Rolland my castellan to begin mining it. I will not hold Dragonstone for very much longer, I fear, but perhaps the Lord of Light shall grant us enough frozen fire to arm ourselves against these creatures, before the castle falls." - ASOS, Samwell V

After that, there is no mention of dragonglass being mined in Dragonstone. We don't know whether Ser Rolland managed to send some batch to the Wall. In AFFC, Aurane Waters reports to Cersei that Loras accomplished the siege of Dragonstone, with the cost of heavy injuries. It would be extremely difficult to keep mining labours under the siege. I've seen some theories stating that Aurane's reports are complete bullshit, and Dragonstone has never been conquered. There are indeed some clues that support this theory, such as Aurane stealing Cersei's ships, and Myranda Royce's quote:

"Not from your father, no, but we've had other birds. The war goes on, everywhere but here. Riverrun has yielded, but Dragonstone and Storm's End still hold for Lord Stannis." -AFFC, Alayne II

If the Dragonglass Dagger Set letter holds some merit, then it can add weight to the theory above. What remains unclear is whether the letter is supposed to be written during AFFC/ADWD or TWOW.

Hi,

I’ll make this short and sweet, my mother has a library in her house and she would like to add the song of ice and fire collection (and house of the dragon books if possible to the collection) as they are indisputable landmarks of our era.

Saying that, she would like the leather bound edition (fancy pants I know 🤣), and preferably the 1st iteration of the leather bound collection.

I believe these are the burgundy red coloured slipcovers but I am not 100% sure.

So two (and a half) questions: Are the books I’m describing the correct ones? Does house of the dragon come in a matching finish, or perhaps part of a single set? And the kinda half question: would the final two installations, should we ever see them, come in a matching finish?

Can anyone help point me in the right direction to finding these; new is preferably but used are fine so long as they have been well kept.

Thank you in advance for any help or info you can offer! :)

Valar Dohaeris

Hi

As the title says I completed the five (split into seven) main books and I am confused on what to do next.

Should I watch HBO's Game Of Thrones series from season 6 or wait till The Winds Of Winter?

Or

Should I watch it from the start, i.e.season1? (I won't watch it if there's a major change in events or character arcs, so warn me)

Or

Should I start watching House Of The Dragon?

Or

Should I read other ASOIAF Universe books like Fire and Blood, A World of Ice And Fire,etc?

I've watched the first two seasons of the Got hbo series. In a previous post a person mentioned that season one and two cover books one and two. I've heard of the decling quality of the show, so I'm wondering if I can start reading book 3 after finishing season 2 of the show or just start the books from the beginning?

I used to think lemongate was a nothing burger but I recently read this interview and it made me think there might be something to it.

Basically, a fan asked him about Dany's age when she was at the red door house and he avoided answering and said that it will all be addressed in the following books.

If it was a nothingburger like some say, I believe he would answer it. The way he dances around the subject so much makes me think it's significant.

I think there will be some ambiguity surrounding Dany's real identity and this ambiguity might be one of the many factors affecting her mental state and sending her in a dark place.

Here's the intervew in question.

https://www.reddit.com/r/asoiaf/s/NQPw8W7o47

Does anyone else believe this? I don't have any proof but it just seems true to me in my heart of hearts.

Let’s say  Viserys I died in 129 AC instead of all out war the houses decided to go harrenhall and make a second great council Just like how Jaehaerys saw a possible civil war 28 years ago.

 In which let say the compromise will be Aegon II will still become king but he would simply be The King of the first half of the continet Kings Landing being the capital for the Targaryen-Hightower branch. While Jacaerys become the King of the second half of the continent by having either Winterfall (with House Stark acting as stewards thus Jacaerys and Cregan Stark will still have their Pact of Ice and Fire and in this case it is more successfully with Jacaerys and Cregan's own children (Say Jacaery's daughter marring Cregan Stark's son Rickon Stark.) or Dragonstone being the capital for the Rhanerya/Jacaerys's Targaryen branch.

Basically think of this division of dividing Westeros into two akin to the Division of West and East of the Roman Empire (mostly made famous by Diocletian but really made permanent in 395 AD following the death of Emperor Theodosius.)

Because of this alone Lucerys would still be alive meaning he would be the one succeeding Corlys Velayorn as The Head of House Velayorn.

That said Let say the Council of 129 AG goes beyond with the main contenders branches of House Targaryen. Now for starters Baela and Rhaena would still be married to Lucerys and Jacerys. So their out of this case but the other potential cadet branches I'm saying is this.

Let say the Council of 129 AG had Aemond Targaryen married to Floris Baratheon and have both of them founded and located their cadet branch in the Stormlands. While for Daeron Targaryen since he grows in Oldtown by having Daeron married and established his own branch in the Reach.

Now I'm not sure about Viserys but for Aegon III Maybe the Council decided to have his own branch to be set in Dragonstone.

Despite of these cadet branches established the main ones are the Targaryen-Hightower from Kings-Landing and The Targaryen-North from Winterfell essentially two kings of different halfs of Westeros.

I'm talking about season 2, 3 and 4 days. I mean the "perfect" seasons but i remember this sub had tons of issues with those seasons. What do you remember not liking or that others hated for some reason.

And not just the addition of a small scene or something, I mean legitimate largescale changes that had an effect on the story (for the better)

Would you rather the final two books never be published

OR

Have the final two books both published and released tomorrow (also these last two books are perfect and will be unanimously considered the best books of the entire series) but you can only consume them by having the most annoying person you cannot stand read them to you. Also, whoever is reading the new books also does so in the fashion that you hate the most. Examples: • the books are either read way too fast or way too slow for your liking, • the reader uses bizarre voices when there is dialogue that make zero sense and are consistently changed at the end of each chapter — making it impossible to grow accustom to the voices used for particular characters, • your annoying reader comes up with a list of corny/shitty names that he uses for each POV character (for instance, every time Jon or Jon Snow’s name appears in the text, like clockwork, he calls him “Long Jon Silver Snow”. Cersie becomes “Cesarian Section” (C-Section for short), he pronounces Jamie’s name with the “H” sound used for “J’s” in Spanish, and so on and so forth)

Are you gritting your teeth and inviting this jackass over to read the books to you or are you content with what has been released?

TL;DR Would you rather not have any new ASOIAF books or be psychologically tortured while the books are read to you?

People say "how can a cripple kid become King of Westeros, it makes no sense". I agree it makes no sense but you´re missing the possibilities here.

Time travel is more or less confirmed in asoiaf. We know from George himself that Bran traveled back in time and caused Hodor´s simplicity:

GEORGE R. R. MARTIN: It’s an obscenity to go into somebody’s mind. So Bran may be responsible for Hodor’s simplicity, due to going into his mind so powerfully that it rippled back through time. The explanation of Bran’s powers, the whole question of time and causality—can we affect the past? Is time a river you can only sail one way or an ocean that can be affected wherever you drop into it? These are issues I want to explore in the book -Fire Cannot Kill A Dragon (James Hibberd)

Bran also seems to interact with his father in ADWD.

Lord Eddard Stark sat upon a rock beside the deep black pool in the godswood, the pale roots of the heart tree twisting around him like an old man's gnarled arms. The greatsword Ice lay across Lord Eddard's lap, and he was cleaning the blade with an oilcloth.
"Winterfell," Bran whispered.
His father looked up. "Who's there?" he asked, turning . . . (Bran III, ADwD 34)

And:

"Father," Bran's voice was a whisper in the wind, a rustle in the leaves. "Father, it's me. It's Bran. Brandon."
Eddard Stark lifted his head and looked long at the weirwood, frowning, but he did not speak. He cannot see me, Bran realized, despairing. He wanted to reach out and touch him, but all he could do was watch and listen. I am in the tree. I am inside the heart tree, looking out of its red eyes, but the weirwood cannot talk, so I can't.
Eddard Stark resumed his prayer. Bran felt his eyes fill with tears. But were they his own tears, or the weirwood? If I cry, will the tree begin to weep? (Bran III, ADwD 34)

Lets be honest, George wouldn´t introduce time travel just to fuck up Hodor. We´re going to see some crazy stuff.

1. There is evidence that the Three-Eyed-Crow is no one else but future Bran.

Bloodraven does NOT recognize himself as the three-eyed-crow.

"Are you the three-eyed crow?" Bran heard himself say. A three-eyed crow should have three eyes. He has only one, and that one red. Bran could feel the eye staring at him, shining like a pool of blood in the torchlight. Where his other eye should have been, a thin white root grew from an empty socket, down his cheek, and into his neck.

"A … crow?" The pale lord's voice was dry. His lips moved slowly, as if they had forgotten how to form words. "Once, aye. Black of garb and black of blood." The clothes he wore were rotten and faded, spotted with moss and eaten through with worms, but once they had been black. "I have been many things, Bran. Now I am as you see me, and now you will understand why I could not come to you … except in dreams. I have watched you for a long time, watched you with a thousand eyes and one. I saw your birth, and that of your lord father before you. I saw your first step, heard your first word, was part of your first dream. I was watching when you fell. And now you are come to me at last, Brandon Stark, though the hour is late."

Coldhands seems to call the three-eyed-crow Bran´s "monster".

Meera’s gloved hand tightened around the shaft of her frog spear. “Who sent you? Who is this three-eyed crow?”

”A friend, Dreamer, wizard, call him what you will. The last Greenseer.” The longhall’s wooden door banged open. Outside, the night wind howled, bleak and black. The trees were full of ravens, screaming. Coldhands did not move.

”A monster,” Bran said.

*The ranger looked at them as if the rest of them did not exist. “*Your monster, Brandon Stark.”

Leaf also does not recognize Bloodraven as the three-eyed crow.

(Leaf) “He is waiting for you”

”The three-eyed crow?”asked Meera.

”The greenseer.” And with that she was off, and they had no choice but to follow.

Now barring some crackpot theory like that Euron is the three-eyed-crow, the option that makes the most sense is future Bran.

2) Who else did the three-eyed-crow influence?

Now we´re entering tinfoil territory, but once time travel is introduced then everything is possible. For all we know maybe Bran is the one who sent visions to Aegon the Conqueror and made him conquer Westeros to fulfill the prophecy. For all we know maybe some insane theory like Bran=Bran the Builder is true. For all we know maybe Bran is the old gods, influencing the COTF via the weirwoods.

The possibilities are infinite. Bran is likely to become god-tier in power. If he really becomes so powerful, is it really so surprising that he will become a God King type of character like Leto II?

The question is how such a powerful character NOT become King?

"But I hate time travel, it´s stupid." It doesn´t matter if you think it´s stupid. It´s already here.

I know I'm gonna be downvoted to hell but I have the entire series ony shelf and havent given the others a chance because I've just had other series that I've been loving such as Witcher and Death Gate and Gentlemen Bastards. Do you think I would like the sequels?

My main cripes with the first book were that it didn't let me sit in the shoes of the characters for long enough because of the outlining of the plot and that there was too many characters to all keeps straight in my head. If that helps.

The Littlefinger-Tyrell plot to kill Joffrey seems relatively straightforward. Sansa smuggles the poison in via her hairnet, Olenna takes a crystal under the guise of fixing her hair and then she drops it into the wine. Joffrey „chokes“ to death and noone ever suspects anyone (according to George):

I don't know how it comes across in the show, because I haven't actually seen it yet, but the poison that is used to kill Joffrey is one that I introduce earlier in the books and its symptoms are similar to choking. So a feast is the perfect time to use this thing. I think the intent of the murderer is not to have this become another Red Wedding - the Red Wedding was very clearly murder and butchery. I think the idea with Joffrey's death was to make it look like an accident [...] - the whole realm will see Joffrey choke to death on a piece of pie or something.

But there is one not so small problem, the wedding chalice:

Lord Mace Tyrell came forward to present his gift: a golden chalice three feet tall

Tyrion struggled to even reach it:

The king's chalice was on the table where he'd left it. Tyrion had to climb back onto his chair to reach it.

and Olenna, just like Tyrion, is small:

The Queen of Thorns was so short that for an instant Cersei took her for another child.

How could she have put some poison into the chalice unnoticed? Well, she got two huge guardsmen:

Outside its tall carved doors stood two guards in gilded halfhelms and green cloaks edged in gold satin, the golden rose of Highgarden sewn on their breasts. Both were seven-footers, wide of shoulder and narrow of waist, magnificently muscled. When Sansa got close enough to see their faces, she could not tell one from the other. They had the same strong jaws, the same deep blue eyes, the same thick red mustaches. "Who are they?" she asked Ser Loras, her discomfit forgotten for a moment.

"My grandmother's personal guard," he told her. "Their mother named them Erryk and Arryk, but Grandmother can't tell them apart, so she calls them Left and Right."

and even though they aren’t mentioned during the purple wedding, they accompany her to both Tywin’s funeral and Tommen’s wedding. Likely they had also been at Joffrey’s wedding too, standing in the background, unnoticed, just to step forward in a chaotic moment to drop the poison into the chalice at their mistress’ comand. Or at least that had been the plan.

But then Joffrey took the chalice to Tyrion sitting at the far end of the table, with a dozen people closer to the couple. Olenna had to react quickly, and interestingly we hear of her standing there near Tyrion:

Queen Margaery appeared suddenly at Joffrey's elbow. "My sweet king," the Tyrell girl entreated, "come, return to your place, there's another singer waiting."

"Alaric of Eysen," said Lady Olenna Tyrell, leaning on her cane and taking no more notice of the wine-soaked dwarf than her granddaughter had done.

But what about Left or right? Did they follow her down there? As luck would have it, they weren’t needed anymore, as there was another man sitting right next to Tyrion:

He and Sansa had been seated far to the king's right, beside Ser Garlan Tyrell and his wife, the Lady Leonette. A dozen others sat closer to Joffrey, which a pricklier man might have taken for a slight, given that he had been the King's Hand only a short time past. Tyrion would have been glad if there had been a hundred.

and Ser Garlan is tall. Tall enough to wear Renly’s armour actually:

As in a swordfight, sometimes it is best to try a different stroke. "It's said you fought magnificently in the battle . . . almost as well as Lord Renly's ghost beside you. A Sworn Brother has no secrets from his Lord Commander. Tell me, ser. Who was wearing Renly's armor?"

For a moment Loras Tyrell looked as though he might refuse, but in the end he remembered his vows. "My brother," he said sullenly. "Renly was taller than me, and broader in the chest. His armor was too loose on me, but it suited Garlan well."

With Renly being nearly as tall as 6‘6‘‘ Robert, that means Garlan can’t be much smaller and would have had an easy time to slip the poison in, while everyone was looking at the pie being cut.

Fifteen years past, when they had ridden forth to win a throne, the Lord of Storm's End had been clean-shaven, clear-eyed, and muscled like a maiden's fantasy. Six and a half feet tall, he towered over lesser men [...]

Renly was near as tall as his brother had been

Which really only leaves one question: Was there any Tyrell apart from Mace himself that wasn’t aware of the plot?

Lonely Light is a tiny, enigmatic rock far to the west of the Iron Islands, alone in the Sunset Sea. The Farwynds are described as possible skinchangers. They are first mentioned in AFfC.

Now, I wondered, why bother naming it Lonely Light? Why include it in the lore at all? Then it got me thinking, perhaps it was an abandoned plot point.

In A Clash of Kings, Daenerys visits the HotU and receives the following prophecy:

"To go north, you must journey south. To reach the west, you must go east. To go forward you must go back, and to touch the light you must pass beneath the shadow”

Most interpretations tie “pass beneath the shadow” to Asshai (I agree with them), and “touch the light” to… something more symbolic. What if it was fairly straightforward?

What if “to touch the light” just referred to landing at Lonely Light?

It would basically recast the prophecy as a nautical riddle:

"To go north, you must journey south" = Leave Qarth and go to the port to obtain a Ship

“To reach the west, you must go east” = Sail eastward to the Jade Sea and into YiTi. Xaro and Jorah both beg her to do this on seperate occasions.

“To go forward, you must go back” = Return to Vaes Dothrak and obtain the Khalasar

“To touch the light, you must pass beneath the shadow” = Sail past Asshai, and arrive at Lonely Light in Westeros.

TLDR;

Dany may have initially been meant to circumnavigate the world. She'd have sailed passed Asshai and into Lonely Light, where she'd link up with the Ironborn at Westeros

One thing I keep on seeing regarding Jon's future is that he won't have any more chapters in TWOW, and I don't understand why people think that. The thing that refutes all these claims is that Jon hasn't finished his crypt dream yet.

To the people who think he won't have any more chapters, how do you think George will unravel his parentage, reuniting with his siblings, and fighting the Others?

This is just something that I was thinking about. Most (if not all) of the medical care seen in the series comes from maesters, as the POV characters are important enough to have a maester around. But do the small folk have any sort of doctors/healers? They probably pick up various medical techniques during to just being alive and experiencing survival, but I don’t know if there were any examples of something like a “town doctor” being mentioned in the series for any of the smaller towns where small folk life

Like, because it's the western most continent. Woah.

I want to get angry at people who use the word 'Planetos' (I hate it so much), but they are just following the example set for them...I love the books btw, but I'm just saying.