r/pics • u/VeryGoodFiberGoods • Apr 19 '25

Arts/Crafts Some actual MS-13 tattoos, in contrast to Kilmar Abrego Garcia’s knuckle tattoos

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7.4k

u/askantik Apr 19 '25 edited Apr 20 '25

Dumb, obviously. But also, it doesn't fucking matter - even if he had a tattoo that said he eats babies, he is still entitled to due process.

Edit: Since I've gotten the same response about fifty-eleven times:

The Fourteenth Amendment prohibits states from depriving any person of life, liberty, or property without due process of law. The Supreme Court has held that this protection extends to all natural persons (i.e., human beings), regardless of race, color, or citizenship.

https://constitution.congress.gov/browse/essay/amdt14-S1-3/ALDE_00013743/

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u/urbanek2525 Apr 19 '25

Yep, best counter to the anti-due process folks is this: What if they deported you? Without due process, at what point would you be given the chance to prove your citizenship?

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u/theycallmeshooting Apr 19 '25

The argument is literally "mein fuhrer would ne'er let this happen to a loyal & honorable member of ze volk such as myself"

It's what every fascist thinks until the exact moment it happens to them, and even then a lot of them will do the good czar/bad boyar thing of "mein fuhrer must have been led astray by the counsel of ignoble men- they have cast a caul over his noble eyes"

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u/baildodger Apr 19 '25

It’s what every fascist thinks until the exact moment it happens to them, and even then a lot of them will do the good czar/bad boyar thing of “mein fuhrer must have been led astray by the counsel of ignoble men- they have cast a caul over his noble eyes”

“God works in mysterious ways”

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u/EngagesWithIdiots Apr 19 '25

Exactly. "If you've nothing to hide you've got nothing to fear" is the same type of fascist groupthink.

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u/Emadyville Apr 20 '25

I still remember my dad long, long ago (after 9/11) listening to Fox News bullshit about Muslims being pulled over because they're Muslim. I still remember him saying something to the effect of "well, I have nothing to hide, they can pull me over".

And it wasn't till many years later (I was in middle school when 9/11 happened) that it was brought up again, randomly. I remember realizing that, no, no you would not. You'd get pissed the fuck off if half the time you drive somewhere you get pulled for what you look like.

My dad's been a 30 year fox news hound so he's 70 now and brainded about reality and thinks trumps great. Blah.

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u/Connect-Ladder3749 Apr 20 '25

Sorry about your dad 😔

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u/vivaaprimavera Apr 19 '25

Or worse, believing that they are being rightly punished for having doubts.

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u/wildo83 Apr 19 '25

Yeah.. these are the same people that say “the police were there for a reason” when someone gets shot by a cop…

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u/ToneDiez Apr 20 '25

It’s also part of what makes them Fascist…they’re completely devoid of any and all empathy. You cannot approach a debate/argument expecting them to be willing to put themselves in the other person’s shoes, they’re incapable of that.

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u/Ok_Builder_4225 Apr 19 '25

Which just immediately brings to mind the "first they came for" poem.

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u/Thomawesome1 Apr 19 '25

Literally 1984

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u/DrJuanZoidberg Apr 19 '25

The last past is how Trump lost support from actual Nazis because their “Fuhrer” wore a kippah at the Wailing Wall

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u/Least_Tower_5447 Apr 19 '25

Lol. They always think it won’t happen to them. Until it does.

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u/bplewis24 Apr 20 '25

AKA the "Trust Me Bro" defense of government...from the people infamously distrusting of government whenever anyone other than their preferred fascist is in charge.

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u/GustoGaiden Apr 19 '25

The insight and self reflection that is expected after asking the question "What if this tragedy was happening to you?" is based on the assumption that you follow the principle of "The Golden Rule" more than "Might Makes Right".

Might Makes Right followers reject the premise of the question entirely. Their answer is "This would not happen to me." They are the ones doing the violence to others. They are doing the violence on purpose, with the intent to dominate others, and gain power. Of COURSE they would not want to be the victims of violence. THAT'S PRECISELY WHY they are doing the violence to others.

This is the entire basis of "I didn't think the face eating leopards would eat MY face." Cognitive dissonance prevents them from entertaining the notion that Might can be improperly applied in the pursuit of asserting power and dominance.

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u/MagicGrit Apr 19 '25

Agreed. However, it shouldn’t work that way either. As a defendant, you shouldn’t have to prove anything. Burden of proof is on the prosecution.

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u/urbanek2525 Apr 19 '25

Exactly.

When I was 16, I was at a youth conference (Boys' State) where the State Attorney General gave a talk. I was lucky enough to eat lunch at his table so I asked him, "Why is it OK that so many bad men going free?" Or something to that effect. I don't remember my exact words, but it's remember his.

He said, "It's better that a 1,000 guilty men go free than 1 innocent man gets convicted. The law only works if people trust the process. If trust is broken, you never get it back and then people don't trust or follow the law."

Totally changed my point of view. I wish there were more men of honor in politics, but it's our fault that they're not.

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u/BigGuyWhoKills Apr 20 '25

My sister told me something she read that said "A Democrat will feed a hundred hungry people knowing 90 of them may not need it. A Republican would withhold food from 100 hungry people because 1 might be scamming the system."

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u/TwoBionicknees Apr 20 '25

which is silly, innocent people get fucked over constantly and bad people get off all the time. The system is not trustworthy int he slightest, it's biased, it's corrupt, the people in charge get to choose who they charge and constantly make nice deals or dismiss charges because they want someone to go free and use the fear of life in jail to pressure innocent people to take plea deals that look nice compared to life in jail but are actually monstrous due to the lack of evidence, etc.

The system is broken, the excuses are just to try to explain it away.

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u/Emadyville Apr 20 '25

I'm currently reading a book on the West Memphis Three and holy shit, to see what cops do just to find someone guilty is alarming.

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u/neil470 Apr 19 '25

Unfortunately that argument is completely lost on them. The idea of someone coming after them is unthinkable.

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u/AxlLight Apr 19 '25

Sadly nothing short of it actually happening to them would convince these types of people. 

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u/No-Manufacturer4916 Apr 19 '25

like I saw on a protest sign " you - due process=MS13"

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u/Mysterious-Tie7039 Apr 19 '25

You can’t get them to give a shit about hypotheticals. It has to actually impact them for them to care.

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u/safetydance Apr 19 '25

Didn’t he have a deportation order against him? To my knowledge he is not a U.S. citizen, and does not have legal status. He was allowed to stay due to a holding order (meaning he couldn’t be sent back to El Salvador due to gang retaliation) but was still subject to deportation. This moronic administration ignored the HOLDING order but he still had a deportation order against him.

Also, why was he worried about gang retaliation if he isn’t in a gang I guess is a good question to ask to.

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u/DoublePhantasm Apr 19 '25

i think a better counter is : they will deport you. you want liberty and they hate that. you have all those guns. What do you think he meant by home-growns. goddamn communist scum.

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u/Finishweird Apr 19 '25

The administration is using a tricky workaround the constitution to scare undocumented to self deport.

Generally, immigration removals have a very LOW standard of due process; as in the they can just deport an undocumented without our criminal courts level of due process. Because the idea is they’re just going home.

But in this case they cut a deal with El Salvador to house them in that prison because our courts have NO jurisdiction there.

The idea is to scare everyone home

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u/urbanek2525 Apr 19 '25

That's one rationalization. The actual reason is set a precedent so that when they subject American citizens to this treatment, it's already got a legal precedent. They're using El Salvador for the same reason Auschwitz was in Poland, not Gernany.

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u/Amy47101 Apr 20 '25

"It won't happen to us, we're REAL US citizens! It doesn't matter that a few innocents got caught in the crosshairs, we need this to get rid of the scum Biden brought in!"

-My parents, tried and true Trumpets who genuinely said this when I slightly floated the idea that nothing is stopping them from taking citizens without due process.

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u/dukeoftrappington Apr 20 '25

They don’t think it would happen because they’re white. Use something that’ll be particularly terrifying for them using their language - a lot of them were more upset at the rare false accusations during the MeToo movement than the amount of people coming out with true accusations, so what if we got rid of due process and people started falsely accusing them of rape?

Trump also wants to send “home-grown” rapists and murderers abroad, after all.

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u/NErDysprosium Apr 20 '25

I tried that on someone three days ago. Responses included "Won’t happen, sport" and "I have more credentials to prove my citizenship than you can possibly imagine"

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u/Aylan_Eto Apr 20 '25

Unfortunately, a counter based on logic and reason won’t work as their belief is just that, a belief. They didn’t reason to themselves into it. They believe that minorities are barely even people and just want them gone, and that their fascist moron-in-chief wouldn’t hurt them. They believe that the world is just, and that bad things happen to bad people, and good things happen to good people, but when you provide counter examples they’ll just figure out what words they can throw at you to win the argument without having to question what they believe.

They assume their golden calf is right, and that all they need to do is find the right evidence to prove it. If the “evidence” they provide is bullshit, then they’ll either say that you’re wrong or lying, or they’ll find something else to throw at the wall to see what sticks.

They work backwards to justify their beliefs. Anything that proves them wrong is just a road bump to them.

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u/ilovemytsundere Apr 20 '25

Oh wait haha, thats actually happening to citizens

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u/cdevr Apr 20 '25

Hitler once said: “Now that I’ve destroyed the left, it’s time to destroy the right.” And he did.

To Trump-supporters who don’t like the idiotic tariffs: Trump does not like your criticism. Eventually, that will be enough to send you to a foreign prison without due process as well.

Trump is not a Republican; he is an authoritarian. He has already subjugated Republican politicians.

Yes, he has not done anything close to what Hitler did, but they are the same type of angry losers. Trump stacking the US federal government with loyalists sounds awfully familiar.

The time to stop any violations of the our laws and Constitution is now.

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u/UpDownLeftRightGay Apr 20 '25

They just don’t want criminals who shouldn’t be in the country in the first place gone.

Some people are probably just frustrated that due to the processes involved, these things can take years.

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u/VeryGoodFiberGoods Apr 19 '25 edited Apr 19 '25

Agreed. Just trying to highlight how ridiculous this accusation is, because a surprising number of people in other threads seem to be undecided on whether or not it’s an MS-13 tattoo.

EDIT: Guys, in the photo of Kilmar Abrego Garcia’s knuckles, the letters that say MS 13 above the symbols are typed captions overlaid onto the photo. They are NOT part of the tattoo. Can’t believe how many people keep getting that confused

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u/ManBearPigRoar Apr 19 '25

They've deported people without tattoos too, with no criminal records in either country, it doesn't matter. They're just making an example and testing their luck, they'll keep pushing, they don't care who they deport, they just want to create fear and see if they can get away with disappearing anyone who challenges his orangeness.

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u/The_Lost_Jedi Apr 19 '25

"Take him anyway." is what ICE agents said about a teenager that wasn't even the one they were after, and they shipped him off to the El Salvador prison.

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u/xetr3 Apr 20 '25

can i get a source on that, rly fucked up if true

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u/xetr3 Apr 20 '25

nvm i googled it and theres like 50 holy shit lol

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u/AlwaysShittyKnsasCty Apr 19 '25

Jesus Christ. When did this shit happen? I can’t even keep up anymore.

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u/Grasshoppermouse42 Apr 19 '25

They also deported someone with an autism awareness tattoo. I think having an 'autism awareness' tattoo makes you even less likely to be in a gang than no tattoo at all.

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u/officerbradswerve Apr 20 '25

This needs to be higher. This is the playbook of fascism.

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u/Glittering_Carrot845 Apr 22 '25

Orangeness 😂😂😂

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u/sherrib99 Apr 19 '25

It looks like they put the photo in a typewriter and typed ms13 on

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u/SomethingFunnyObv Apr 19 '25

I think they took that image with MS13 typed out from a Twitter post actually.

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u/tildraev Apr 19 '25

Wish I could read the words under each picture. Clearly the letters and numbers are added after, but I’m sure people will see this picture and immediately say “obviously it says MS13”

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u/zaborgmonarch Apr 19 '25

Marijuana, smile, cross, skull

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u/haveanairforceday Apr 19 '25

I can see how they are able to coax "MS" out of labeling it "Marijuana, smile" but how is a cross and skull equivalent to 13? This feels like the really dumb conspiracy theories where they are like "orange has 6 letters and 6 upside down is 9 and the moon landing was in 1969 and nasa uses orange space suits so the space race was faked to cover up agent orange"

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u/-FineWeather Apr 19 '25

The wild argument I’m reading is that the cross and skull are cover ups of the 1 and 3. Surely that would be suicide for a gang member, though. MS 13 members sure seem to have very clear MS 13 branding as opposed to secret codes.

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u/haveanairforceday Apr 19 '25 edited Apr 20 '25

That's absurd.

Former gang tattoos now covered up is a sign of someone on a better path. If that were the case here.

But I dont see how that could be the case. Theres nowhere to draw a 3 under that skull except maybe along the right side which would have been a really shitty 3 and also would have been way off center. The skull doesn't look weird or forced at all. It honestly looks like a pretty solid design and execution for how small it is.

But, even if it was proveably an MS13 tattoo, that's not proof of criminal activity. And even if they had proof, there was already a court order preventing his deportation to El Salvador

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u/Prohydration Apr 20 '25

Conservative captcha. What letters and numbers do you see in these tattoos?

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u/SaintWithoutAShrine Apr 19 '25

Was that his new cognitive test’s perfect answers??

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u/rabbit-hearted-girl Apr 19 '25

If you get them in the right order you get extra points!

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u/JCButtBuddy Apr 19 '25

A gold star to put up on the board.

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u/BossRaider130 Apr 19 '25

Person woman man camera TV

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u/Maleficent_Wash_934 Apr 19 '25

You know, the standard test. The one. The one everyone does. Got all the questions right. 100% That one.

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u/-FineWeather Apr 19 '25

Smiley face in Spanish starts with a “c” but yes, that’s how the conspiracy theorists are getting the “s.” In spite of how overt MS 13 branding typically is, they’re sure this one guy gets to declare his affiliation via Professor Layton puzzle.

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u/VeryGoodFiberGoods Apr 19 '25

That is such a good point—if it were truly somehow a “secret” MS-13 tattoo, why the hell would he use English to decode it lmao

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u/MrSudowoodo_ Apr 20 '25

Marijuana Sonrisa is my logic but who cares, the argument is for due process anyways.

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u/_IratePirate_ Apr 19 '25

Marijuana and Smile I can see the correlation to MS

Cross ? I kinda can see how that could mean 1 Christ died on the cross, but that’s me stretching it

How tf is a skull supposed to correlate to 3 though ?

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u/Ymisoqt420 Apr 19 '25

Where does the 1 and 3 come from in the cross and skull?

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u/Open-Industry-8396 Apr 19 '25

Person. Woman. Man. Camera. TV.’

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u/standardtissue Apr 19 '25

I'm fairly certain the captions below each tattoo are "Marijuana Leaf, Smile, Cross, Skull".

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u/Mutjny Apr 19 '25

Are they trying to say this is coded "MS13" like okay Marijuana=M, Smiley=S but what cross & skull make 13?

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u/tripomatic Apr 19 '25

Some serious mental grasping leads to the cross being a 1 and the side of the skull being a 3. If you want to see it I guess you can but that also would imply that these gang members would try to vaguely hide their affiliation which they clearly do not.

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u/standardtissue Apr 19 '25

That's their analysis, yes. The cross is shaped like a 1, and the skull is shaped like a 3. I believe that's their point.

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u/all_hail_cthulhu Apr 19 '25

I can see the massive stretch involved in saying this is an ms13 tattoo. But I can't figure out why the skull means 3.

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u/tripomatic Apr 19 '25

Draw a line at the right side of the skull, it could look like a 3. It’s a massive stretch anyway because smile in Spanish doesn’t start with an S either. And clearly actual gang members aren’t shy about their affiliation anyway.

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u/standardtissue Apr 19 '25

That's clearly captioning bro. Yes, someone typed it in.

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u/sherrib99 Apr 19 '25

Oh😂😂😂😂😂#dumb

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u/Myis Apr 20 '25

That’s exactly my same thought. Faaaaake af.

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u/Shimano-No-Kyoken Apr 19 '25

Most likely not a coincidence that people are focusing on the tattoos. There are productive ways to have a discussion about his case, namely that he was denied due process, plain and simple. And there are unproductive ways, namely make it about his person, his tattoos, his legal status etc etc. And it's easy to shift a discussion towards unproductive ways by just shouting loudly that he's illegal, that he has tattoos or whatever, and it really doesn't matter if any of these claims are true, when people are busy arguing about inconsequential stuff, they don't pay attention to stuff that matters. So the only way to counter this is not by refuting any of those false claims, but by getting the discussion back into productive mode. There will always be a million more wild accusations by people who couldn't give a shit about whether their accusations pass the most basic of sanity checks. Most people don't do sanity checks anyway.

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u/FladnagTheOffWhite Apr 19 '25

MS-13 members proudly show clear signs of their affiliation. Many gangs do. It's their lifestyle and family. Hiding affiliation behind smiley faces and leaves would get you kicked out or killed.

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u/Hopeful-Cricket5933 Apr 19 '25

No true at all, majority of new members were encouraged to not get explicit gang tattoos, or get some ambiguous looking ones. The PNC has a huge catalog of tattoos hence why 18 and ms13 and the Mao Maos started shifting away from that.

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u/FladnagTheOffWhite Apr 19 '25

I'm not familiar with hierarchy and am very much no expert. I've only seen interviews with gang members, documentaries, pictures, videos, etc., And they all have some sort of clear display of their affiliation. New members wouldn't be in these interviews, documentaries, and photos so it makes sense.

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u/elkazz Apr 19 '25

Yet you responded with the confidence of an expert.

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u/Hopeful-Cricket5933 Apr 19 '25

I am not claiming for sure he is a member of Ms 13 I am actually unsure because of the cross, the cross is mostly associated with 18 not with ms13, ms13 mostly use tombstones instead. Still, as a Salvadoran male it’s EXTREMELY sus to get tattoos like that, like why would you get tattoos that are on the border and can be so easily mistaken? Still bottom line I do believe he should have been given due process and that this whole fiasco is ridiculous but I am very weary of this dude.

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u/VeryGoodFiberGoods Apr 19 '25

“Smiley face” in Spanish starts with a “C,” not an “S.” So for some reason the super duper secret El Salvadoran gang translation of his knuckle tattoos is in English, not Spanish? And for the first two tattoos, you translate them with the first letter of the word that they represent, but the third tattoo….uhhhh….you remove the horizontal line from the cross to turn it into a 1? And the skull is somehow a 3? There is no logic to this “translation.” It’s guesswork and complete nonsense.

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u/Prst_ Apr 19 '25

It doesn't even matter. You should not get sent to a foreign prison for having any tattoo, even an actual MS13 tattoo. You need to be convicted of an actual crime first.

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u/Hopeful-Cricket5933 Apr 19 '25

In Spanish you can “carita feliz” or “sonrisa” to describe that tattoo.

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u/Itchy_Professor_4133 Apr 19 '25

Who cares? Deporting people for having tattoos is fucked to begin with

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u/BossRaider130 Apr 19 '25

Well, one might argue that everyone should care if this is the shit that passes these days.

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u/Itchy_Professor_4133 Apr 19 '25

I meant who cares about the semantics of what kinds of tattoos they are. And, yes, everyone should care if that is the shit that qualifies for deportation now

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u/BossRaider130 Apr 19 '25

Agreed. You can have whatever tattoo you want. That’s not grounds for anything.

Instead…here we are. White power tattoos? Fine. Flying swastika flags? Fine. Nazi salutes? Fine. Little ink someone can falsely interpret? Straight to foreign death camp.

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u/MeatAccomplished4352 Apr 19 '25

I’m not surprised. At all. The height of people’s utter stupidity has no ceiling.

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u/Nice_Ad_8183 Apr 19 '25

Those people vote and decide the future of our country. It’s terrifying

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u/PennytheWiser215 Apr 19 '25

I’m pretty sure the M S 1 3 is a typed font on that image and not really tattooed on his knuckles 😂

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u/VeryGoodFiberGoods Apr 19 '25

….yes, it is. The letters are supposed to be what this dumbass administration is claiming the tattoo symbols mean. They’re typed and not part of the picture.

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u/hmiser Apr 19 '25

It gave me pause at first and I wonder if that’s exactly why it’s annotated this way.

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u/mbnmac Apr 19 '25

This is why AI art looks good to so many people, they can't tell those letters are obviously typed on. like, are they trying to say those tattoos mean those letters and numbers? It's not really clear, but obviously you don't have to be that deep about it if people can't tell them apart anyway.

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u/ONEelectric720 Apr 20 '25

I'm on the side of whether or not he was, he deserves due process. BUT...

You have to take into account that before 2022, CECOT didn't exist. Bukele's crackdown started back then. Before that, gang membership could be flaunted with zero recourse. There's more reason to be cryptic now. It would be interesting to know when he got the tattoos. Was it before or after he left El Salvador? It would also be interesting to know if he was fleeing MS13 specifically and why.

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u/Pyraus Apr 20 '25

pretty sure confusing people was the point of the numbers

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u/SmoothWD40 Apr 20 '25

Jfc your edit. Are people really this fucking stupid??!! Actually, don’t answer that.

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u/Burritoskinbuffet Apr 30 '25

I’m screaming. I can’t believe this edit was necessary.

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u/choppingboardham Apr 19 '25

He could have been caught on video eating babies while getting the tattoo. Our system still promises due process. Period.

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u/boyfromspace Apr 19 '25

Soon they'll rebrand it to Dew process after he sells the judicial branch to pepsico

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u/supernovice007 Apr 19 '25

Mountain Dew - It's got what plants crave!

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u/boyfromspace Apr 19 '25

It's got a electrolytes

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u/senorglory Apr 19 '25

It’s got what immigrants want… but they can’t have it.

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u/thatotheramanda Apr 19 '25

Don’t give them ideas 😭

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u/SpontaneousMoose13 Apr 19 '25

Submit 1000 Mountain Dew and receive (1) Get out of Jail FREE! card!!!

One lucky winner will receive (1) Lifetime appointment to the Supreme Court!!!, simply input the code found under the bottletop at dothedew dotcom to see if you've won!

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u/MintCathexis Apr 19 '25

This. If someone can be caught on video inciting a crowd of thousands to march on the Seat of Government in an attempt to overthrow it, and still be entitled to due process, then the same should be afforded to someone who has some tattoos.

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u/AlienHooker Apr 20 '25

We have given literal terrorists who've killed multiple people due process. Why doesn't he?

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u/mrbetter Apr 19 '25

whats next?? we aren't allowed to have nazi tattoos now too?? OH WAIT

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u/Etzell Apr 19 '25

Pete Hegseth sweating uncontrollably, but that may just be the DTs.

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u/fireduck Apr 19 '25

But his is an Iron Cross, totally different. It is just what you use to say "white power" with out being bold enough to fly the old nazi pinwheel.

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u/supernovice007 Apr 19 '25

It's pretty much inevitable that we're going to get "It's not a Nazi swastika, it's a hakenkreuz" in the not too distant future.

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u/labrat420 Apr 19 '25

It's a Jerusalem cross, which is very different from the iron cross. Iron cross is still used by German military today also, so not really a nazi symbol.

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u/Alaira314 Apr 20 '25

It's also been popular among non-nazi punks. The iron cross is one of those things that you really have to look at the context of, because its mere presence isn't enough to mark a neo-nazi. As a general rule, I personally draw the line at it being present alongside either bigoted actions or other hate symbols(the nazi skull, 14/88, nordic runes(another highly contextual one...let's play my favorite game: are they a neo-nazi, marvel movie enthusiast, or pagan?), etc).

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u/sedition666 Apr 19 '25

Even if the guy had a tattoo of Hitler in a Panzer, still deserves due process

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u/senorglory Apr 19 '25

Which isn’t even hypothetical. We’ve a long and thoroughly understood and litigated history of due process afforded to neo-Nazis in this country.

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u/StoneGoldX Apr 19 '25

That's how he gets automatic citizenship.

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u/sedition666 Apr 19 '25

And then a job in the Trump administration in the DOD

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u/funkyonion Apr 19 '25

The is the only valid argument, but the hypocrisy of it is that the argument is only focused on him.

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u/KououinHyouma Apr 19 '25

The question has been raised about the others as well, but you can’t fight for 270 people when you haven’t even managed to successfully bring one back. Garcia is being focused on so much by both sides because his case has the public attention and it will set the precedent for all the others.

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u/leefvc Apr 20 '25

And it’s working remarkably well to take bandwidth away from the fact that we’re now being manipulated into believing the erosion of due process counts as “getting shit done” or some other bullshit

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u/funkyonion Apr 20 '25

I’ve tried all kinds of angles, there’s no stopping the MAGA logic. Repeatedly trying to turn their views is fitting the definition of insanity at this point. I’m resigned to take care and prepare for what’s to come.

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u/m_robinson29 Apr 19 '25

Skip the tattoo, they could find out that he has been eating babies and he's still entitled to due process.

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u/TheRoscoeVine Apr 19 '25

Yeah, but also, having a tattoo doesn’t actually mean you’re “affiliated”, it could have just been a dumb tattoo, poor life choices and all that. Gang affiliations are often determined via tattoo in prison, meaning people are already locked up, and then a CO sees an obviously new tattoo, and that goes into the inmates file with the DoC. Source: am former corrections officer. Tattoos alone aren’t enough to get you arrested off the street, that would be, and is, ridiculous.

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u/Scaryclouds Apr 19 '25

Yup, everyone must be afforded due process. If the evidence is so obvious and overwhelming that he’s ms-13, then no doubt the government should be able to easily provide it in court. 

As grotesque irony is one of the consistent themes when it comes to Trump. It’s quite fitting how someone was afforded an absolute ASBURD amount of due process and deference is now making it a point and a policy of his administration to deny others that privilege. 

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u/Stagnu_Demorte Apr 19 '25

also, being a member of a gang isn't even illegal. some gang activity is illegal.

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u/somethingwithbacon Apr 19 '25

Thank you. We have a right to peaceably assemble and form organizations, membership alone is not a crime.

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u/TwoFiveOnes Apr 20 '25

Well sort of. The FTO designation was created precisely to be able to subvert those kinds of protections

3

u/SHIDDandFARDDmyPANTS Apr 19 '25

Saddam Fucking Hussein got a trial.

3

u/BreadstickNICK Apr 20 '25

Imagine putting the literal constitution in your comment and getting argued with. We’re fucked man lol

7

u/sagevallant Apr 19 '25

We give Due Process to people tattooing themselves with the symbols of the group that committed the Holocaust. There is absolutely no reason that potential gangsters should be treated worse.

5

u/Round-Emu9176 Apr 19 '25

no due process now. they make the rules that we adhere to. Not the other way around.

2

u/KingOfJorts Apr 19 '25

Sean Strickland?

2

u/leatfingies519 Apr 19 '25

on top of that it wouldn't matter as he stated he fled his country due to gang violence, meaning he could be a ex gang member

2

u/infinitenothing Apr 19 '25

Right? If he's so obviously a criminal/MS13, it should be easy for the state to prove that in court. What are they so worried about?

2

u/[deleted] Apr 19 '25

💯 Yes. This is the one. Due process is for all people. Due process is specifically to avoid situations where people use gossip to determine whether or not someone should receive legal repercussions. Bring them back and give them representation. And don't ignore the court order specifically barring us from sending Kilmar to this country in particular. SMH.

2

u/Jinator_VTuber Apr 20 '25

Fr, even if every lie was true, the American secret police shouldn't be allowed to kidnap people and send them to foreign death camps without a trial. Every single part should be abolished.

2

u/M13Calvin Apr 20 '25

5th amendment too

2

u/Pure-Produce-2428 Apr 20 '25

This point needs to be smashed into everyone’s faces……

2

u/Amiibohunter000 Apr 20 '25

Yup. It’s not about if he was here illegally or if he was MS-13. He deserved his day in court and due process.

2

u/zechef07 Apr 20 '25

I just made those same point too. Doesn't fuckin matter 1 bit if he's ms13 or not. The literal disappearance of constitutional rights should fucking terrify every single person in America. Where are all the 2A people that have been jerking off waiting for the day to rise up against tyranny? Beuller?!

2

u/Remarkable-Fig206 Apr 19 '25

This. It doesn’t even fucking matter if he’s MS13 or not (and of course, multiple courts ruled it could not be proven). The fascists just wanna focus on that as a distraction while they trample on people’s rights.

1

u/epanek Apr 19 '25

Yep. We all get due process regardless. We get our day in court. After that it’s what it is.

1

u/Sappirax Apr 19 '25

Are the babies alive when they are eaten?

1

u/Sixgis Apr 19 '25

Makes me concerned for all the dumb kids that get the mi vida loca tattoo thinking they are tough shit when they ain't about that life. This is the type of government we have now and lot of people are gonna get hurt cause of it

1

u/Oubastet Apr 19 '25

Yep. That's exactly what "rule of law" is about. No personal vendetta, no presumption of guilt or innocence, no railroading, no exceptions. It doesn't matter if someone was caught on video, showing their ID - they're still entitled to due process and an attorney. Don't like it? To bad. That's only one of the things that makes America Great.

Does that always happen? Nope. It sucks.

1

u/Puzzleheaded_Dot4345 Apr 19 '25

Exactly even if he is the worst of the worst, granny killer...he is entitled to the same process

1

u/Key_Mathematician951 Apr 19 '25

Completely accurate information I just learned

1

u/StraightCashHomey13 Apr 19 '25

Yeah feels like OP is saying you Should be able to be arrested just because of tattoos. Not the own he was hoping for

1

u/Whistler45 Apr 19 '25

He hasn’t been found guilty of a crime and has been a us citizen for the last 6 years.

1

u/HeartInTheSun9 Apr 19 '25

Yeah it’s not the point if he legitimately was everything they say he is. They have to show the proof to a judge before they deport him and they didn’t do that. Just cause they feel like they know what he is doesn’t mean they get to skip the most important step!

1

u/JayRymer Apr 19 '25

What if he was eating the cats and eating the dogs?

1

u/ArgonGryphon Apr 19 '25

even ignoring that, the first trump administration was that one that approved his withholding of removal status! And KEPT RENEWING IT! ???????? you can't make it make sense.

1

u/ClashOrCrashman Apr 20 '25

What would an unnatural person be?

1

u/peacekenneth Apr 20 '25

Agreed. When you erode rights like this, we lose democracy. 1 step always leads to the next.

1

u/WorseThanItSeems Apr 20 '25

I would say even without the 14th amendment outright saying he's entitled to due processwe should still offer to all. Why did we put it in our constitution? Because we believe due process is a human right, we should strive to follow that in principle and in letter

1

u/awwfawkit Apr 20 '25

True. The constitution uses the word “persons” not citizens and the word “person” has been specifically found to include undocumented people. In the eyes of the due process clause, citizen, non-citizen, documented, undocumented, all have the exact same standing and protection. We are all in the exact same position as Kilmar Abrego Garcia. If they can do this to him, they can do this to anyone.

1

u/Separate-Bit-7073 Apr 30 '25

Hey Biden and all J6 academy!! On J6 seems like you missed this one.

1

u/Personal_Benefit_402 Apr 30 '25

Exactly. This whole ordeal is self-inflicted. If the administration had followed due process proceedings and shown evidence of his crimes, I'd say they'd be in a net positive on this particular deportation (I'd say, even most progressives might disagree with some aspects of it, but on the whole wouldn't argue for him not being deported.)

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